Q Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Devon, I've read Atlas Shrugged, and I have to say...Ayn Rand is undoubtedly the worst writer of the 20th century. Good idea for a story, absoloutely terrible execution and story-telling. I have all her other books but I'm pretty sure I'd rather remove my eyes with a sharp instrument than read another one of her books. Hehehe... Personal taste I guess. I found Ayn Rand's writing style and the philosophies she presented to be very interesting and very different from what I usually read. Not at all like Marx. I would hope so. Rand was about as anti-Marxist as anyone could get. Her anti-socialist arguments as expressed in Atlas Shrugged are compelling, as well as correct, IMO. I am however, sorry, EmpDev, but I have to agree with Fish.Stapler. Atlas Shrugged is a wonderful story that is absolutely ruined by Rand's out-of-control metaphorical meanderings. It's a truly excruciating read. Rand was undoubtedly brilliant, but it took her 100 words to say what Orwell could in 10. I'm on or around page 750 and can go no further for now. I'll finish it -someday. Any poetry by the Brownings, Keats, Shelley, other Romanticists Add Coleridge to that list. He's my favorite. Has anyone ever read The Rime of the Ancient Mariner or Christabel? I enthusiastically recommend both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted March 31, 2007 Author Share Posted March 31, 2007 If you're talking adventure stories, then, add in any of Clancy's novels that involve Jack Ryan or Grisham's more adventure-based novels. His book "The Brethren" is just plain wicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achilles Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Add Coleridge to that list. He's my favorite. Has anyone ever read The Rime of the Ancient Mariner or Christabel? I enthusiastically recommend both. Ancient Mariner was required reading in HS. I agree that it is a very good read. Speaking of required reading that worth reading again, how about Milton's Paradise Lost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HK-42 Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 Douglas Adams The Hitchikers 5 book trilogy are great books. 1. The Hitchikers Guide to the galaxy. 2. The Restaurant at the End of the Universe 3.Life, the Universe and Everything 4.So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish and 5. Mostly Harmless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Devon Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 Her anti-socialist arguments as expressed in Atlas Shrugged are compelling, as well as correct, IMO. Far from it. The economic anarchy she advocates would never work. You can't simply turn the gov't into nothing more than a police force and let corporations grab all the power they can get. Not to mention how disastrous having no public works at all would be. The philosophical parts of Objectivism I disagree with just as much. Selfishness is not a virtue and kindness is not a sin. Rand was undoubtedly brilliant, but it took her 100 words to say what Orwell could in 10. Definitely. That was one of my favorite things about the book. Douglas Adams The Hitchikers 5 book trilogy are great books. Albeit very simple ones. I prefer more serious/educational/advanced books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 The philosophical parts of Objectivism I disagree with just as much. I guess that I should have stated that while I agree with her anti-socialist views, I do not agree with her Objectivist philosophy, which seems to be the extreme opposite of socialism. My bad. Selfishness is not a virtue and kindness is not a sin. Agreed. One must be extremely careful with kindness, however, because it can be a real liability when dealing with unscrupulous types. This may sound harsh, but kindness should be reserved for those who deserve it, not those who exploit it. Speaking of required reading that worth reading again, how about Milton's Paradise Lost? Seconded! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted April 1, 2007 Author Share Posted April 1, 2007 How do you guys feel about a Paradise Lost/Dante's Inferno compare and contrast thing? Obviously that would take us longer, but i think it might be an interesting discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Devon Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 I guess that I should have stated that while I agree with her anti-socialist views, I do not agree with her Objectivist philosophy, which seems to be the extreme opposite of socialism. My bad. Ah, that's a relief. You had me worried you were a real Objectivist there for a second. This may sound harsh, but kindness should be reserved for those who deserve it, not those who exploit it. I agree. Exploiting kindness goes completely against the nature of it; in my opinion it's just as bed as petty thievery. Ayn Rand, though, advocates thinking about yourself and yourself only. The idea of organized charities, financial support for those in need, or simply giving someone a helping hand goes completely against what Objectivism stands for. How do you guys feel about a Paradise Lost/Dante's Inferno compare and contrast thing? Obviously that would take us longer, but i think it might be an interesting discussion. Excellent idea. It's been a few years since I read Inferno, though I've not yet tried out Paradise Lost. It could make for some good discussion. If anyone's interested, here's the complete text of the Inferno. It's excellent stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavlos Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 How do you guys feel about a Paradise Lost/Dante's Inferno compare and contrast thing? Obviously that would take us longer, but i think it might be an interesting discussion. Alright, I'm up for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canderous_ordo1 Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 just done reading a great book Darth bane path of destruction it was a great story right up the the last page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavlos Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 Albeit very simple ones. I prefer more serious/educational/advanced books. You're limiting your reading experience by sticking to "advanced books," ED. Not all books exist to educate, or provide some sort of moral insight into the world. Pure entertainment is often an excellent reason to read a novel. Yes, I do derive pleasure from the thought that the author may have meant more than the literal with his use of metaphor or simile but I don't believe that is the only reason a person should read . I'm about to commit the ultimate sin for one looking to join an online book club but: I enjoy reading Harry Potter, travel books by Bill Bryson and so forth - unless I've missed something, I don't think Harry Potter has something to say about the state of society. It is entertainment; that is why it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth InSidious Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 You're limiting your reading experience by sticking to "advanced books," ED. Not all books exist to educate, or provide some sort of moral insight into the world. Pure entertainment is often an excellent reason to read a novel. Yes, I do derive pleasure from the thought that the author may have meant more than the literal with his use of metaphor or simile but I don't believe that is the only reason a person should read . I'm about to commit the ultimate sin for one looking to join an online book club but: I enjoy reading Harry Potter, travel books by Bill Bryson and so forth - unless I've missed something, I don't think Harry Potter has something to say about the state of society. It is entertainment; that is why it works. Even though I hate Those Books for their sickly-sweet icky saccharine innocence, QFT/E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Devon Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 You're limiting your reading experience by sticking to "advanced books," ED. Perhaps I wasn't clear enough I used that term. By 'advanced' I meant something moreso than, say, a book meant for high schoolers (HGG in this case). Plot-wise, concept-wise and in pretty much all respects they're fairly simple. Not all books exist to educate, or provide some sort of moral insight into the world. Pure entertainment is often an excellent reason to read a novel. Education and moral insights are pure entertainment to me. unless I've missed something, I don't think Harry Potter has something to say about the state of society. It is entertainment; that is why it works. It has some messages if you look, (albeit simple ones) mainly being loyal to friends, standing up for yourself, not always going with the herd, etc. It's not very common to find a book that has no type of underlying idea or reasons for why that idea is a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMaster12 Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 Education and moral insights are pure entertainment to me. Then where's your sense of adventure man? Jae the idea with Infero and Paradise Lost is a good idea. I have read the Inferno and have taunted mach to name the quote, particularly the line about what is written over the gates of hell. The Inferno I thought was interesting in regards to the ranking of sin. It reflects on how we rank crime today if you think about it. The worst crime is usually murder and treason and in the modern world, we have the harshest punishment for capital murder and treason...death. I haven't read Paradise Lost so that is one more on my ever growing reading list. On another note, I have been reading my research materials again since I will be presenting some time in May and I came across my book Tales of the Plumed Serpent. For those who like tales of other cultures then this is a good book. It has all the tales of Mesoamerica and the Peruvian Incas that have been recovered through oral tradition and codices, the picture books. My personal favorites are the Tales of the creation, especially The Fifth Sun and The Birth of Huitzilopochtli. The reason I could tell you these stories is because they relate to my research...Aztec Human sacrifice. yes these are Aztecan tales but the book also has Mayan, Olmec and Inca. Easy to read along with insights of specific culture things like the calendar round. Good book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth InSidious Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 @ED: That's the beauty of the Guide - it has no didactic undertones, no hidden messages, no further meanings. It's refreshingly simplistic, I find In a similar vein, and @everyone, The Diary of a Nobody is well, well worth reading. I would in fact go so far as to say that it's absolutely brilliant, in fact. David Rohl's A Test of Time is an interesting alternative timeline for those with an egyptological interest, though it should be brought into consideration that David's theories make a mess of Hittite history, and should not be taken as the whole truth. Island of the Blessed by Harry Thurston is a fascinating look at the Egyptian oasis of Dakhla, and very easy to read. Finally, I would recommend to all Christians, Catholics included, certainly, and to all interested in Christianity generall, Mere Catholicism by Fr. Ian Ker, who is, co-incidentally, the leading authority on John Henry Newman. This slim volume really is well worth reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentScope001 Posted April 4, 2007 Share Posted April 4, 2007 @ED: That's the beauty of the Guide - it has no didactic undertones, no hidden messages, no further meanings. It's refreshingly simplistic, I find Well, there was a lot of hidden messages within the Guide. The absurdity of it all made fun of real science fiction stories that have meaning behind it. It claims people read stories for fun, not to learn life's lesson, and it was a very damning critique of the seriousness of sci-fi stories. That is a very hidden meaning, a secret message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted April 5, 2007 Author Share Posted April 5, 2007 Mere Christianity by CS Lewis is terrific. His Chronicles of Narnia are good books, too. Seems like a number of us are interested in The Inferno and Paradise Lost. Anyone have an preferences on which one to do first? I figured we could do one at a time and discuss each seperately, and then have a bit of discussion on compare/contrast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderWiggin Posted April 5, 2007 Share Posted April 5, 2007 I would very much enjoy the discussions we could have here. I also think that most, if not all, of the books mentioned here are valid ideas for future reading (or re-reading, as the case may be). I concur with the idea of a Dante/Milton read. If this is was intended to start in April, then we should get started soon, hmm? And if we want to be chronological, then Paradise Lost would seem to be the place to start. I'll wait for the go-ahead. _EW_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted April 5, 2007 Author Share Posted April 5, 2007 Getting started on that is fine by me. Other pairings I thought might be interesting after we finish these first 2 books: Achilles' suggestion of Beyond Oil along with Gore's An Inconvenient Truth Obama's The Audacity of Hope with O'Reilly's Culture Warrior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achilles Posted April 6, 2007 Share Posted April 6, 2007 ugh...O'Reilly?! I'll do it, but you have to promise no Ann Coulter, ever (!!!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted April 6, 2007 Author Share Posted April 6, 2007 Ugh. Ann Coulter drives me up a wall. Only Rush is worse. I dislike ultra-conservative harpies just as much as ultra-liberal ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q Posted April 6, 2007 Share Posted April 6, 2007 @Jae: I was going to reply to your Milton/Dante suggestion a couple of days ago, but I forgot. Anywho, I'm all for it. There are some sharp minds here and a fresh perspective or two would be welcome. Ugh. Ann Coulter drives me up a wall. Only Rush is worse. I dislike ultra-conservative harpies just as much as ultra-liberal ones. Not to mention the fact that she could use about three Big Macs a day, each with fries and a shake. I can't decide whether to call her "Right-Wing Barbie," or "Anorexic Barbie.":xp: The fact that she dresses provacatively doesn't help, either, as it only accentuates her gauntness. She really needs to eat something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jae Onasi Posted April 6, 2007 Author Share Posted April 6, 2007 I think she may have had cancer at one point and had chemo/radiation for it, which would explain her gaunt look. Even after treatments it can take awhile for someone to bounce back to a more normal weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achilles Posted April 6, 2007 Share Posted April 6, 2007 I dislike ultra-conservative harpies just as much as ultra-liberal ones. Err...what do you consider O'Reilly then? Calling oneself fair and balanced does not make it true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderWiggin Posted April 6, 2007 Share Posted April 6, 2007 Are we going to make a plan or a structure for reading? I would very much dislike spoiling something for someone who is reading at a different pace, or on the same note, someone doing the same to me. _EW_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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