Scream For Independence!

[Fredi]

Well I am a person who believes that each country should rule bye him self, I live in Puerto Rico is a island in the Caribbean and it is part of the U.S.A but it is not a state and is not part of any state at all we are just “Part of them” a Unincorporated territory, I don’t like it, I would love to see Puerto Rico in depended and free. Wooden you like to see you’re country free? See it been rule by your own people and have a national representation in the world?!!.... I do, I know that there are other Countries like mine that are in this state, like Guam, In Spain there is the Basque people they want freedom for them because they simply don’t have the same culture as the Spanish, nether my country have the same culture than the Americans, I have hearth in Scotland there’s a movement for independence (SNP) and I have heart that for ages the Scottish people have fought for independence, William Wallace a great patriot for the Scottish and many more patriots that have fought, many have died trying to see there country free..

 

 

If you like I feel this need to scream to let out what you feel….. Let it out here! Please let’s talk of this serious matter.

[Emperor Devon]

Why would you ever want that? Puerto Rico gets all the benefits of being a U.S. state with nowhere nearly as many taxes.

[Fredi]

U.S.A would not accept us as state, if they do they will have to give more money to our system and we would provably be the poorest state and U.S.A wouldn’t like that ... plus give us state so do to Guam and Virgin Island.... And sorry emperor devon but I and many of us prefer be to be independent ... We are not Americans we are LatinoAmericanos.... Latin-Americans we have our own culture.... no need to submit to another. And the U.S.A dose not give’s us free money it’s from our own production and from our taxes that we maintain our self... Plus U.S.A should thanks us and Latin’s because we are you’re army.

[GarfieldJL]

Why would you ever want that? Puerto Rico gets all the benefits of being a U.S. state with nowhere nearly as many taxes.

 

Not quite, they don't get to vote in the House of Reps, or Senate. However, Devon has a point, you basically are already a country on its own for the most part. Then there is the fact you're already technically a US citizen as things stand currently.

 

Puerto Rico does have taxes, but last I checked none of them were by the Federal Government in the United States.

[SilentScope001]

Why should Pureto Rico gets freedom when Vermont gets to continue to stay within the Union, despite having 30% of people wanting to leave the Union?

 

And, what about me? I can't leave the United States of America. That would be illegal. If I go and claim my own house as an indepedent state and form my own military, I would be arrested and sent to jail. Why should you guys be free when I can't declare my own nation as well?

 

Hey, I love the ability to have basically every single person on the planet be free, able to choose themselves. But, er, we can't have it, for obivous reasons (anarchy FTL). And not only that, but you can't even get it democratically, those other voters want to vote either to be a State or Keep Status Quo, thereby stopping the Indepedence movement. I know you want to stay within the Union, but can't we spilt Pureto Rico in half: Loyalists get the North, Revolutionaries get the South? Man, times like these make me wish the Confedearcy won the Civil War.

[John Galt]

I was under the impression that PR has had the issue put on the ballot several times, but has always chosen to stay an unicorporated territory, although I could be mistaken.

 

*waits for someone to mention the CSA*

[Fredi]

Why should Pureto Rico gets freedom when Vermont gets to continue to stay within the Union, despite having 30% of people wanting to leave the Union?

 

And, what about me? I can't leave the United States of America. That would be illegal. If I go and claim my own house as an indepedent state and form my own military, I would be arrested and sent to jail. Why should you guys be free when I can't declare my own nation as well?

 

Hey, I love the ability to have basically every single person on the planet be free, able to choose themselves. But, er, we can't have it, for obivous reasons (anarchy FTL). And not only that, but you can't even get it democratically, those other voters want to vote either to be a State or Keep Status Quo, thereby stopping the Indepedence movement. I know you want to stay within the Union, but can't we spilt Pureto Rico in half: Loyalists get the North, Revolutionaries get the South? Man, times like these make me wish the Confedearcy won the Civil War.

 

We are a country not a house... And why you are complaining why would we should be independence?.... because we are not Americans and don’t have the same culture , dose who are loyal to U.S.A well they have 50 states to choose and go live there. About the Vermon project, they have there reasons, great citizens but I can’t talk by them because I don’t know they’re type of situation.

 

And John in 1950 a man Name Luis Munoz Marin make a project to give PR free association with the base of later having Independence too bad he is not alive to see the big mistake he did by attaching us more because the U.S.A control our economy and that means that we are attached.

[SilentScope001]

We are a country not a house... And why you are complaining why would we should be independence?.... because we are not Americans and don’t have the same culture , dose who are loyal to U.S.A well they have 50 states to choose and go live there. About the Vermon project, they have there reasons, great citizens but I can’t talk by them because I don’t know they’re type of situation.

 

You don't understand. I'm not complaining about you wanting to be indepedent. I'm complaining on why I can't be indepedent, and why in the world can't I free myself from Yankee imperialism while you get to smile and be free.

 

Not that I want to declare indepedence, but I like to have that right, in principle.

[Fredi]

You don't understand. I'm not complaining about you wanting to be indepedent. I'm complaining on why I can't be indepedent, and why in the world can't I free myself from Yankee imperialism while you get to smile and be free.

 

Not that I want to declare indepedence, but I like to have that right, in principle.

Then fight for you’re rights and If you are from Vermont then keep fighting for you’re believes, You just don’t get nothing standing and doing anything , that’s why I decided to do this post because I want people to know that there countries out there that want independence , an Silentscope I am not smiling because I am not free like you.

[Corinthian]

We are the Borg. Lower your guns and surrender your flags. We will add your monies and your fineries to the Reserve. Your culture will adapt to service us. Protests are useless.

 

Really, though, what do you have to complain about? Lower taxes, the protection of the United States Military, near-independence...really, if you want to be independent, move to Antarctica.

[John Galt]

No offense, but I think Puerto Rico is kinda better off as a US territory. From what I've heard the electorate there has repeatedly voted to remain an unicorporated territory ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto_rico#Political_history ) several times.

 

Besides, look what happened to the rest of Latin America...

[Fredi]

We are the Borg. Lower your guns and surrender your flags. We will add your monies and your fineries to the Reserve. Your culture will adapt to service us. Protests are useless.

 

Really, though, what do you have to complain about? Lower taxes, the protection of the United States Military, near-independence...really, if you want to be independent, move to Antarctica.

 

Antarctica is not my home country plus if you are more intelligent you will notice that we live in the Caribbean it’s hot here, we will provably die there unless that’s what you want?

 

Lower Taxes: There is a 9% tax plus a tax that is added when the product arrive.

 

Near Independence: If you so call near independence when another country is controlling you’re economic well you are really wrong.

 

Protection of PR: First there are no military bases in PR and second we are you’re army.

 

[Fredi]

No offense, but I think Puerto Rico is kinda better off as a US territory. From what I've heard the electorate there has repeatedly voted to remain an unicorporated territory ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto_rico#Political_history ) several times.

 

Besides, look what happened to the rest of Latin America...

 

Well if you have a candidate that tells you. “I will lower the taxes, I will try a fight against unemployment, I will take action and bring more money” will you vote for him? Any body would but what? This damn “Populares” are liars that only say thing’s but don’t do nothing, and people in PR don’t vote for a Side they vote for the guy that is rich so will PR will when he wins the campaign. And that’s the biggest and dummies thing happening here

[Samuel Dravis]

Near Independence: If you so call near independence when another country is controlling you’re economic well you are really wrong.

I am curious - in what way is your economy being controlled that you find distasteful?

 

Also, what reasons in particular do you have other than economic and and a semi-distinct culture (I say semi because here in Texas Mexican/Latino culture has merged to a large degree with American one). I'm sure it would be fun to say that you're an independent state, but I'm not sure that it would all be fun and games if you did become so.

 

Taxes - I have 8.25% state sales taxes (no state income tax, fortunately), on top of municipal taxes. Add federal taxes on there, including medicare, fica etc, and then you are starting to look lucky.

[Prime]

Wooden you like to see you’re country free? See it been rule by your own people and have a national representation in the world?!!.... I do

It sounds great and all, but what are the downsides? I can't speak to Puerto Rico specifically, but do they get at least some funding from the US? Other benefits? Would the standard of living decrease my seperating? Just make sure that by asking for the goodm things, you are willing to accept all the bad things.

[Fredi]

I am curious - in what way is your economy being controlled that you find distasteful?

 

Also, what reasons in particular do you have other than economic and and a semi-distinct culture (I say semi because here in Texas Mexican/Latino culture has merged to a large degree with American one). I'm sure it would be fun to say that you're an independent state, but I'm not sure that it would all be fun and games if you did become so.

 

Taxes - I have 8.25% state sales taxes (no state income tax, fortunately), on top of municipal taxes. Add federal taxes on there, including medicare, fica etc, and then you are starting to look lucky.

 

We found distressful that we can not control our deal our economic relations because the U.S.A is in control of that. And Latin’s go to the U.S.A to fallow the so called “American Dream” they try to look way to benefit there lives and the lives of his family.

 

Another reason for Independence other that economic and culture is things we sure don’t like about U.S.A, If a war is called we have to go and fight, let me tell man in Vietnam almost all the people that fought there for the Americans where Puertorricans and black people. Now in Iraq there many soldiers that are many Puertorrican. You really don’t understand because you don’t live here day to day, we are here in a constant war against the politic.And 55% of PR money end up in the hands of the U.S.A and we cant use it to make better roads more projects more school’s and other things. They are Imperialist

[John Galt]

Puerto Ricans aren't drafted. They are afforded the title of honorary American citizens, at the pleasure of Congress, and many _Volunteer_ for service in the US Armed Forces in order to become full US Citizens.

 

edit: And if the US is such an "Imperialist Power," than why on earth did we allow plebiscites in Puerto Rico to determine whether the people there wanted to be a US State, an Unincorporated Territory, or an independent nation?

[Fredi]

Puerto Ricans aren't drafted. They are afforded the title of honorary American citizens, at the pleasure of Congress, and many _Volunteer_ for service in the US Armed Forces in order to become full US Citizens.

 

edit: And if the US is such an "Imperialist Power," than why on earth did we allow plebiscites in Puerto Rico to determine whether the people there wanted to be a US State, an Unincorporated Territory, or an independent nation?

Right now is volunteered but in World War II and in Vietnam wasn’t, the U.S.A is a Imperialist power like it or not, It has colonies with a title of “Non incorporated territory” like Guam, Puerto Rico , Virgin Islands , The Mariana islands and Samoa

[Corinthian]

Welcome to the real world. Really, what do you have to complain about? You're self governed. You practically are independent, except you also have those benefits AND the benefits of being part of the most glorious nation of the United States of America.

[GarfieldJL]

Right now is volunteered but in World War II and in Vietnam wasn’t, the U.S.A is a Imperialist power like it or not, It has colonies with a title of “Non incorporated territory” like Guam, Puerto Rico , Virgin Islands , The Mariana islands and Samoa

 

 

If we were truely an Imperialist Power, we wouldn't let you be complaining about being part of the United States. People disappear all the time in China for speaking out in protest.

[True_Avery]

If we were truely an Imperialist Power, we wouldn't let you be complaining about being part of the United States. People disappear all the time in China for speaking out in protest.

Quoted for truth.

 

So, Padawan, how well do you think your country could so without USA support? Not saying you can't, but how well do you think?

 

So far the only real downside to this debate is the fact you arn't in congress, and leaving the US would give no real benifits buts being independent.

[Corinthian]

And you might as well already be independent anyway, Puerto Rico is self governed.

[GarfieldJL]

And you might as well already be independent anyway, Puerto Rico is self governed.

 

 

Puerto Rico is protected by the US military, so Puerto Rico doesn't have to spend money on their own military.

[Fredi]

Most glorious country? ….. U.S.A is one of the most corrupted places, they only care for money, petroleum and they’re on need. Why have the U.S.A is involucrate in al the modern wars? Iraq-Petroleum, Word War I and II because of the great depression they needed money and war brings money. U.S.A is not the most glorious for me its Swiss or Italia, beautiful countries with no politic disorder union amount people.

 

True_Avery we can do it by our self, we have agriculture, manufacture, and it is possible that in the north of PR there is a reserve of Natural gas… So I think that a nice treat with Venezuela or Colombia for petroleum can make it worth.

 

We may choose a governor and control only what happens inside PR but what about treat for commerce and control our economy we can’t, that’s why I believe in independence for PR.

 

We don’t need defense of another country we can make our own army, plus PR is no target for any country.

 

And as I said to you GarfieldJL Imperialism is a country that is in command of another political or economical.

[mimartin]

Most glorious country? ….. U.S.A is one of the most corrupted places, they only care for money, petroleum and they’re on need. Why have the U.S.A is involucrate in al the modern wars? Iraq-Petroleum, Word War I and II because of the great depression they needed money and war brings money. U.S.A is not the most glorious for me its Swiss or Italia, beautiful countries with no politic disorder union amount people.

 

Check the history books, WW I and WW II were not caused or declared due to US provocation. True the Japanese attacked us do to our embargo against them, but the war in Europe was going strong by 1941. The lend lease program did produce jobs for this country, but not from our allies as we footed the bill for most of the equipment we shipped to England and Russia. In my opinion the US leadership was very interested in entering the war against Hitler, but the America people were against involvement until that infamous Sunday morning in December of 1941. Now the Gulf War and the Iraq war may have been fought to protect the oil supply, but WW I and WW II were not fought out of greed.

 

I’m not saying the US system of government does not have corruption in it, but calling the US “one of the most corrupted place” is a little out of line. A majority of the citizen are hard working, good people that only care about making the world a better place for themselves and the next generation. I guess every time there is a natural disaster around the world we are giving food, money and clothing just because we hope to steal from these poor people in the future? You can call America a lot of things, but we care about a lot more things than money and petroleum. We care about things like liberty, justice and freedom. We don’t always live up to our high ideals, but at least we give it an effort.

 

You have the right to say it is not glorious, that is a personal opinion. I don’t know if it is or isn’t the most glorious as I’ve only visited Mexico and Australia, but I think it is alright and wouldn’t want to live any other place in the Northern Hemisphere (I did say I went to Australia).

 

As to the original topic, I would say yes if a majority of people of Puerto Rico want independence then by all means they should have it. Although I do agree with a lot of the other posters that I do not think it is a good ideal, but hopefully my understanding of the situation is wrong and it would be a prosperous independence.

 

How would Puerto Rican independence affect tourism from the US? Or does that matter?

 

Imperialism by strict definition is true in this case, but I’d like to know just how is the U.S. restricting the Puerto Rican economy? Is it because we do not allow trade with Cuba? Is it we send over too many tourists?