Return to Monkey Island

[KestrelPi]

3 minutes ago, KestrelPi said:

Alternatively: similar to above, but at some point it transitions between guybrush visiting the with his parents to Guybrush taking his own kids there. But the park is now older, a little more run down, some of the attractions have lost a bit of their lustre, and it's not what it was before. Guybrush starts to imagine what Melee island would be like now, if he returned to it after all these years...

 

Even wilder and more specific theory. Guybrush starts talking to his kids about how he used to come to this place with 'your Uncle Chuckie.' You know, '....before he died...' and then the subtext of the whole game is him returning to this park and coming to terms with the death of an older brother with whom he had a... complicated relationship.

[Knight Owl]

I guess it depends on how much Ron wants to go in the direction of "everything is a metaphor" vs "everything is actually real and happening." Somehow I want both to be true.

[KestrelPi]

35 minutes ago, Knight Owl said:

I guess it depends on how much Ron wants to go in the direction of "everything is a metaphor" vs "everything is actually real and happening." Somehow I want both to be true.

I should say that while this is my idea for what a way to go from carnival back to MI universe could work, I don't necessarily have an opinion about how much the carnival vs the MI universe is 'real' and I can see this kind of idea working in either case.

[Thrik]

Remi’s eagle eyes strike again.

 

 

[demone]

I'm curious to see what LeChuck's ambitions are in this one. While history would imply he would want Elaine again, I think there's something much bigger going on. He didn't even give her a thought in Revenge, so I'm really interested what route they take with the character. I always wondered if LeChuck wanting to marry Elaine was simply just about having her by his side forever. There is one curious line he says in the original "With years of planning almost ruined by my death," which seems to imply that he had plans for Elaine even before their first encounter.

 

In the novel, On Stranger Tides, Blackbeard wanted to marry Beth in order to gain the powers of man and woman. Since that novel inspired Monkey Island, I wonder if there is something there and LeChuck wanting to marry Elaine was much bigger in scope for his ambitions.

Edited July 2, 2022 by demone

[Utwarrior]

3 hours ago, demone said:

I'm curious to see what LeChuck's ambitions are in this one.

 

In the first game, LeChuck is feared by every pirate on every island in the Caribbean. That doesn't seem to be the case for the new very important pirates. Maybe he will team up with Guybrush to confront them.

[OzzieMonkey]

5 hours ago, Thrik said:

Remi’s eagle eyes strike again.

 

 

This is a crazy thought, but that thing on fire looks very tent-like to me, albeit in miniature form. LeChuck enters what looks like a tent at the end of the trailer, so what if there's a pocket dimension inside this thing, maybe the carnival? 

[tonybreznak]

New user, long time fan of the series. I find it interesting that Stan has his outfit from Monkey 1, while the other characters from Monkey 2 has the same outfits as they had in that game. Also, on the webpage of the game, Stan does not talk about his used coffin business, only about his used ship business. Maybe the game takes place.... between Monkey 1 and 2? But LeChuck is in his zombie form, so maybe not.

Edited July 3, 2022 by tonybreznak
Clarification

[Vainamoinen]

Badges, fish bait, and keys.

 

Did anyone notice how that's what this part seems to revolve around?

 

The pirate leaders seem to have badges. The fish bait adorns Guybrush's as well as Elaine's outfit, and is found in quite a few background pictures as well. And the keys are everywhere including on the crown of Brr Muda's king.

[OzzieMonkey]

19 minutes ago, Vainamoinen said:

Badges, fish bait, and keys.

 

Did anyone notice how that's what this part seems to revolve around?

 

The pirate leaders seem to have badges. The fish bait adorns Guybrush's as well as Elaine's outfit, and is found in quite a few background pictures as well. And the keys are everywhere including on the crown of Brr Muda's king.

If there's ever a point in the game where I have all three in my inventory, you can bet I'm going to try combining them ASAP.

[Vainamoinen]

2 minutes ago, OzzieMonkey said:

If there's ever a point in the game where I have all three in my inventory, you can bet I'm going to try combining them ASAP.

 

I'll just combine everything with everything as always.

[OzzieMonkey]

2 minutes ago, Vainamoinen said:

 

I'll just combine everything with everything as always.

Of course, we're assuming that inventory combination is still present. I hope it is anyway, to me that's almost more important than verbs. I'm just curious to see what the UI even looks like, "context-sensitive interaction" and "reactive dialog trees" is an incredibly vauge description for those of us who are familiar with the interfaces of the old games.

Edited July 3, 2022 by OzzieMonkey

[Vainamoinen]

20 minutes ago, OzzieMonkey said:

Of course, we're assuming that inventory combination is still present. I hope it is anyway, to me that's almost more important than verbs. I'm just curious to see what the UI even looks like, "context-sensitive interaction" and "reactive dialog trees" is an incredibly vauge description for those of us who are familiar with the interfaces of the old games.

 

Yeah, that would be a real downer. And I haven't had any downer yet for this game, just vague fears of what could (not) be.

[OzzieMonkey]

3 minutes ago, Vainamoinen said:

 

Yeah, that would be a real downer. And I haven't had any downer yet for this game, just vague fears of what could (not) be.

The only thing that made me worried so far was when Ron tweeted that one character from a cross-stitch shared with him wasn't going to be in the game, and there was a disturbing lack of mentioning the Voodoo Lady by anyone until the trailer came out. Ended up getting more than I bargained for with returning characters I'm so happy about Wally, I really wanted to see him return in Tales but sadly it didn't happen so I was really hanging out for it this time. 

 

There's other little things that I hope happen, like I  want there to be an opening credits sequence, not just the theme on the Main Menu. Let the suspense for this new game build a little bit. Chapter Screens obviously, I'm super excited to find out what their titles are as I progress. Man, I haven't had those experiences feel fresh in years.

Edited July 3, 2022 by OzzieMonkey

[KestrelPi]

I'm sure Dave Grossman has an opinion about item combination. I mean, they felt strongly enough about including it in Tales that they built it into the actual interface.

 

But something I do have confidence in, is that even if they do ditch it (which I think is unlikely) it'll be because whatever modes of interaction they've come up with now, they feel like it isn't needed for this game to build good puzzles with. I doubt they'd ditch it just for the sake of simplicity.

Edited July 3, 2022 by KestrelPi

[OzzieMonkey]

Is there a release date yet? How about now?

 

 

 

...How about now?

 

 

...GIMME!  

[Vainamoinen]

22 minutes ago, OzzieMonkey said:

The only thing that made me worried so far was when Ron tweeted that one character from a cross-stitch shared with him wasn't going to be in the game, and there was a disturbing lack of mentioning the Voodoo Lady by anyone until the trailer came out.

 

Well that cross stitch enigma ended badly for me, because I really wanted Jojo back. 😅

 

But who knows, maybe there's another character who can play the piano. And we have more than enough animals in the game it seems.

[Udvarnoky]

17 minutes ago, KestrelPi said:

I'm sure Dave Grossman has an opinion about item combination. I mean, they felt strongly enough about including it in Tales that they built it into the actual interface.

 

It's interesting because Telltale removing inventory combination from the beginning felt like a conscious part of their "streamline the interface" philosophy. LucasArts did the same thing at turns, only for a Monkey Island sequel to come along and "regress" by accomodating the feature anew. TMI similarly felt like deference to tradition.

 

I don't know if that was Dave's influence or not. I seem to recall an interview with him from the earliest days of Telltale (I had thought it might be this one with Frank Cifaldi, but I cannot find the quote I'm looking for) where he said something to the effect that he more than anyone was in favor of leaving that behind.

[KestrelPi]

31 minutes ago, Udvarnoky said:

 

It's interesting because Telltale removing inventory combination from the beginning felt like a conscious part of their "streamline the interface" philosophy. LucasArts did the same thing at turns, only for a Monkey Island sequel to come along and "regress" by accomodating the feature anew. TMI similarly felt like deference to tradition.

 

I don't know if that was Dave's influence or not. I seem to recall an interview with him from the earliest days of Telltale (I had thought it might be this one with Frank Cifaldi, but I cannot find the quote I'm looking for) where he said something to the effect that he more than anyone was in favor of leaving that behind.

 

Mm. When I think of this stuff from a design perspective I think 'okay, so what do we lose by dropping the thing or gain by having it?' and for me combining items is still one area where adventure puzzles benefit from having that level of depth. But at the same time I don't think you NEED them in order to make an adventure game with good puzzles, especially if you've thought of a lot of other unique puzzle mechanics.

[OzzieMonkey]

3 minutes ago, KestrelPi said:

 

Mm. When I think of this stuff from a design perspective I think 'okay, so what do we lose by dropping the thing or gain by having it?' and for me combining items is still one area where adventure puzzles benefit from having that level of depth. But at the same time I don't think you NEED them in order to make an adventure game with good puzzles, especially if you've thought of a lot of other unique puzzle mechanics.

Yeah, I agree with that. If they have enough other stuff going on in the interface that perhaps facilitates what inventory combination does or at least makes you forget it's gone, then maybe it's not necessary. But if it has everything most adventures have but not that and nothing else added, you can feel the lack of it, especially if the puzzles become easier in its absence. I know that one of the first things I try when I have more than one item is use them together, even if it doesn't make sense to do it just to see if the game has that function.

[OzzieMonkey]

So I talked to Stan on the website again, and his phrasing of the crimes is interesitng. He mentions "directing people with money towards items of apparent value". Now what did he do most recently in the games? He sold treasure maps to Porcelain Power Pirates. Is that business venture finally catching up with him? I know Ron said "porcelain isn't canon" but I think that just means Guybrush's fear of it won't come up, not that the material literally doesn't exist. 

[Vainamoinen]

1 hour ago, Udvarnoky said:

It's interesting because Telltale removing inventory combination from the beginning felt like a conscious part of their "streamline the interface" philosophy.

 

Wait, what am I not getting here? Telltale's Tale had inventory combination, right from the beginning. In fact they made the whole thing more complicated as you had to drag both items into a separate window and hit a combine button. That's not streamlining anything, quite the contrary.

 

52 minutes ago, OzzieMonkey said:

So I talked to Stan on the website again

 

That sounds sooo odd. 😂

 

I'm not even certain that scene is something that's actually in the game. At the very least it's a clever play on NFT and crypto crap. Regardless what Stan did in the later MI parts, they couldn't have anticipated NFT and crypto crap 13 years ago, but when they came up, it was pretty clear to us that these full hands of nothing needed a salesman like Stan to actually sell.

 

 

Edited July 3, 2022 by Vainamoinen
ןןǝds ʇ,uɐɔ ı ʇɐɥʇ sı puɐןsı ʎǝʞuoɯ ɟo ʇǝɹɔǝs ǝɥʇ

[KestrelPi]

Stan is in jail for "marketing related crimes" according to the plot summary but we don't know how much of the dialog tree stuff is real or just a joke. I don't mind if they want to make an NFT joke because honestly that is exactly the sort of grift Stan might get entangled in but at the same I hope they don't lay it on too thick in the game as it would instantly date it and... might be a bit cringey, you know like when your mum sends you anti Trump memes. It's not like she's WRONG but... 😅

[Knight Owl]

Seeing how much focus Stan is given in the game's description compared to other returning characters, I wonder if he's going to be part of the inciting incident. We know there's a judge in the game, and Stan mentions judges and court multiple times in his dialogue tree. Maybe the two are related? Like, are we going to Brrr Muda to free Stan (and fix melee island)?

Edited July 3, 2022 by Knight Owl

[Vainamoinen]

7 minutes ago, Knight Owl said:

Seeing how much focus Stan is given in the game's description compared to other returning characters, I wonder if he's going to be part of the inciting incident. We know there's a judge in the game, and Stan mentions judges and court multiple times in his dialogue tree. Maybe the two are related? Like, are we going to Brrr Muda to free Stan (and fix melee island)?

 

Hmmmmm, let me mull that over.

 

Stan is imprisoned on Melee Island (the cell even has traces of the beverage that Guybrush once poured over the lock). The court would indeed be over on Brr Muda from what we know. But Brr Muda is a monarchy, it has the King of Keys.

 

Elaine as governor would have jurisdiction over Melee Island. BUT we already know that she's into conservation these days. So, hypothetically, Elaine leaves the tri-island area to save all those animals, loses jurisdiction, power vacuum, and bam, the King of Keys annexes the Carribbean (I can hear the cries of "political leftist BS" already).

 

Guybrush to the rescue: He needs to find Elaine and install her as governor, to convince her he has to get those conservationist efforts going (I know New Zealand is a ways off, but I'd like to have kakapos in the game, so). Then he has do de-install the King of Keys from power. To do that, he has to right his wrongs, like imprisoning Stan.

 

All a bit far fetched, but I think that would work.