Honor and jedi academy?

[Chewie Bakker]

For crying out loud: Grow up. The lot of you. The lack of respect in here is amazing.

 

"Chat-killing is lame." "Bowing's for n00bs." Gee, they're a couple of strong points, and coming up with a rebuttal for them is going to be difficult, although "You are ignorant" seems to be the most commonly used in this miserable excuse for a thread.

 

Personally, when I played Multiplayer (I stick to map-making now) I'd abide by whatever rules the server dictates. If there isn't a server available that you like, how about making one of your own? Of course, you can stay here and whine like immature brats in the Jedi Academy forum if you'd prefer. Perhaps you could reasonably prove your point in logical debate as opposed to all this pointless mudslinging if you wish to continue this line of "discussion."

 

This thread is both off-topic and a disgrace to the Jedi Knight dot Net forums. I came to the Jedi Academy forums to see what people thought of the upcoming game, not listen to people blather mindlessly about their JK2 multiplayer grudges. I should've known that this thread would be a complete waste of my time by the Subject Header.

[ryudom]

obviously you haven't been paying attention. i suggest you re-read the thread.

[Chewie Bakker]

I'm well aware that the subject is Honor and jedi academy, but all I read in this "thread" were gripes about current MP servers, such as:

Like the others said, if your idea of “serious” servers are only the little saber off = peace isolated RPG play grounds then I feel sorry for you.

And yes, they think the silly little RPG saber rules the newbies follow are… well silly.

and

I'm talking about NF Duel servers moron. In FFA I couldn't care less if people bow or not.

 

I don't know about you, ryudom, but that sounds like negative talk about current MP servers to me, and not talk aboutJedi Academy.

 

<Sarcasm>It's been nice, positive feedback you've been giving eachother, too. very constructive.</Sarcasm>

[Intrepid_JKII]

If there isn't a server available that you like, how about making one of your own?

 

I came to the Jedi Academy forums to see what people thought of the upcoming game, not listen to people blather mindlessly about their JK2 multiplayer grudges.

 

talk about backwards logic. if you want to preach the first statement, then how can you make the second? if you don't like the thread, don't read it. Or better yet, how about making one of your own?

 

Perhaps you could reasonably prove your point in logical debate as opposed to all this pointless mudslinging if you wish to continue this line of "discussion."

 

Some if not most of us have been, but go ahead and paint us all with a broad brush. I guess the second someone, anyone throws a single flame in any thread it becomes invalid. I concede that the thread has taken a harsh tone, but such is the way of life and debating.

 

I'm well aware that the subject is Honor and jedi academy, but all I read in this "thread" were gripes about current MP servers, such as:

 

Well, then read harder. The gripes about JK2 are an asset to the argument regarding JK3. We're trying to talk about the problem of some players imposing their ideas of the way things should be done upon others, and how we want more than anything for this NOT to continue to jedi academy.

[Chewie Bakker]

I admit that some people (but definitely not most people) have refrained from flaming in their posts in this thread, but those who have managed to tarnish it for the rest. I felt that a "broad brush" was the best way to address the situation, and that I'd state my disgust of the contents of this thread.

 

I fail to see how telling people how they should play Jedi Outcast has any bearing on what Raven should put into Jedi Academy. You can't make someone not saber you if you have your lightsaber down just as you can't stop people from attacking you if you have your saber down (I'm using the "Saber down = peace" argument because it seems to have featured highly in this thread). Hence my suggestion for those spoiling for a fight in the forums make their own servers and leave eachother alone in here.

 

And Intrepid_JKII, you're right. I've expressed my opinion on the whole sordid affair, clarified through a few follow-up posts, and am now letting it rest. You'll notice that I've actually kept out of the discussion other than to say it's too rowdy to be productive.

 

I've had my say. Continue your pointless fighting over something that could so easily be fixed by creating your own server (in JK2 and the upcoming JA) if you wish.

 

The Force will be with you, always.

[Rad Blackrose]

Originally posted by Chewie Bakker

"Chat-killing is lame." "Bowing's for n00bs." Gee, they're a couple of strong points, and coming up with a rebuttal for them is going to be difficult, although "You are ignorant" seems to be the most commonly used in this miserable excuse for a thread.

 

Here's a tip for you: use the search engine, then proceed to look through any and all past posts involving server rules, laming, Anti-Saberist Code, Saberist Code, and any other thing you want to throw in there, and you will see that the rebuttal has been said so many times, there's no more blood coming from the stone. So please, cut your holier than thou attitude and have a nice glass of STFU.

 

Personally, when I played Multiplayer (I stick to map-making now) I'd abide by whatever rules the server dictates. If there isn't a server available that you like, how about making one of your own? Of course, you can stay here and whine like immature brats in the Jedi Academy forum if you'd prefer. Perhaps you could reasonably prove your point in logical debate as opposed to all this pointless mudslinging if you wish to continue this line of "discussion."

 

Ditto to Intrepid's reply, backwards logic.

 

This thread is both off-topic and a disgrace to the Jedi Knight dot Net forums. I came to the Jedi Academy forums to see what people thought of the upcoming game, not listen to people blather mindlessly about their JK2 multiplayer grudges. I should've known that this thread would be a complete waste of my time by the Subject Header.

 

Please, who died and made you the head honcho? As I said in the above quote, lose the holier than thou attitude and start downing that STFU.

 

EDIT: MB tags

[ryudom]

I've had my say. Continue your pointless fighting over something that could so easily be fixed by creating your own server (in JK2 and the upcoming JA) if you wish

 

that creating your own server argument is BS. first of all, alot of people can't create there own server. secondly, who is going to play in your server if the fanboys have imposed their ideas on all the players. thirdly, one of the points made was honor freaks coming on to others servers and kicking people that don't abid by their rules.

[Chewie Bakker]

Rad BlackRose has demonstrated the sort of garbage that I'm talking about.

 

I'm well aware of the countless ASC posts there have been in regards to the objection of 'saber off = peace' (which is something I don't agree to, by the way), the SC posts which started this whole fiasco, and the concept of 'laming.' I'm also well aware that this is a forum dedicated to Jedi Academy, not the multiplayer feuds of JK2.

 

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

So please, cut your holier than thou attitude and have a nice glass of STFU.

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

Please, who died and made you the head honcho? As I said in the above quote, lose the holier than thou attitude and start downing that STFU.

Someone pulls you up on your immaturity and they all-of-a-sudden have a "holier than thou" attitude, and you tell them to shut the #%&@ up? This only confirms my earlier statements. There is no argument there, just hostility. Congratulations, Rad Blackrose.

 

Please feel free to flame away, as you just did. Such assaults will be falling upon deaf ears.

[StormHammer]

Rad...your attitude and insulting manner to other members is unwarranted, and not appreciated. That goes for some others too. Feel free to disagree with someone else's point of view, but don't insult them while doing it.

 

I've let this thread stay open so far, even though some comments are hard. But let's just cool it down, eh, people? If you start throwing flames around, this thread will roast in 'closed thread' limbo...

 

As far as 'stopping' people from playing the way they want...good luck. Raven have already stated that in terms of JA they just build the game, and it's up to the community to decide how they want to play it. You can't stop people from doing stuff on servers that they're not supposed to, until you kick/ban them. The RP and Honour stuff is likely to continue (it not actively expand) in JA, so I guess the answer is, as always, get a group together and start your own server to play by your own particular rules. If you don't agree with the rules of a particular server...well, I don't know about you, but if it's not the way I want to play, I just leave. Simple as that. The same goes for servers with egotistical Admins out for their own gratification.

 

Anyway, instead of trading insults and bitching about the current situation, why not get proactive, and constructive, and pull together into 'groups' to set up servers run by your own rules - then maybe we can all agree to 'stick to our own turf'. Sure, I know...not everyone's going to do that, and there will always be someone out to spoil someone else's fun...but it's a start, and there's still the kick/ban option for troublemakers.

 

Maybe it would also be a good idea to have somewhere for people to post about particular servers, with more defined sets of rules for playing on those servers. You get X amount of info when you join a server, but it's often still not enough, and doesn't take into consideration some of the 'rules of play' adopted by regulars.

 

Bottom line...have some more respect for other members who post here. After all, this place is a community, not a Free For All. Thanks.

[Rad Blackrose]

Originally posted by Chewie Bakker

Rad BlackRose has demonstrated the sort of garbage that I'm talking about.

 

I'm well aware of the countless ASC posts there have been in regards to the objection of 'saber off = peace' (which is something I don't agree to, by the way), the SC posts which started this whole fiasco, and the concept of 'laming.' I'm also well aware that this is a forum dedicated to Jedi Academy, not the multiplayer feuds of JK2.

 

 

 

Someone pulls you up on your immaturity and they all-of-a-sudden have a "holier than thou" attitude, and you tell them to shut the #%&@ up? This only confirms my earlier statements. There is no argument there, just hostility. Congratulations, Rad Blackrose.

 

Please feel free to flame away, as you just did. Such assaults will be falling upon deaf ears.

 

*insert eyeroll here*

 

Yeah, there's open hostility over people who come here thinking they can spout utter fallacies then expect not to get hammered back.

 

Since this board opened the question, "How can we stop the honor crap" was immediately popped, and it wasn't by me either. Considering the fact that this IS a continuation of the Dark Forces series, and also considering the fact that this IS almost the same gameplay as JKII, you can bet your ass that the honor codes will be back.

 

But no, you come in here trying to act like a bitchy mother scolding a child, and you got burned. GC256 was one thing, but your attitude takes the cake.

 

EDIT:

 

Rad...your attitude and insulting manner to other members is unwarranted, and not appreciated. That goes for some others too. Feel free to disagree with someone else's point of view, but don't insult them while doing it.

 

Well, half these posts are practically flamebait...

[ryudom]

i think storm and, to some degree, bakker, have a point. maybe instead of flamming the fanboys we should think of possible ways to convert them.

 

here's mine:

 

first you'd go to differant servers, and own some people up. but make sure you follow the server rules, somewhat (maybe bind a key to /say ready instead of bowing heh). anyway after you pwn them up and maybe give them some advice on their game, tell them of an upcoming tourney or ladder happening.

 

i think the key is getting them involved in some competition. i think most people on those servers are competitive, but have been brain washed with the SC. anyway it would take some work, but i'd really like to see this community turned around

[Rumor]

Originally posted by StormHammer

Rad...your attitude and insulting manner to other members is unwarranted, and not appreciated. That goes for some others too. Feel free to disagree with someone else's point of view, but don't insult them while doing it.

 

I've let this thread stay open so far, even though some comments are hard. But let's just cool it down, eh, people? If you start throwing flames around, this thread will roast in 'closed thread' limbo...

 

As far as 'stopping' people from playing the way they want...good luck. Raven have already stated that in terms of JA they just build the game, and it's up to the community to decide how they want to play it. You can't stop people from doing stuff on servers that they're not supposed to, until you kick/ban them. The RP and Honour stuff is likely to continue (it not actively expand) in JA, so I guess the answer is, as always, get a group together and start your own server to play by your own particular rules. If you don't agree with the rules of a particular server...well, I don't know about you, but if it's not the way I want to play, I just leave. Simple as that. The same goes for servers with egotistical Admins out for their own gratification.

 

Anyway, instead of trading insults and bitching about the current situation, why not get proactive, and constructive, and pull together into 'groups' to set up servers run by your own rules - then maybe we can all agree to 'stick to our own turf'. Sure, I know...not everyone's going to do that, and there will always be someone out to spoil someone else's fun...but it's a start, and there's still the kick/ban option for troublemakers.

 

Maybe it would also be a good idea to have somewhere for people to post about particular servers, with more defined sets of rules for playing on those servers. You get X amount of info when you join a server, but it's often still not enough, and doesn't take into consideration some of the 'rules of play' adopted by regulars.

 

Bottom line...have some more respect for other members who post here. After all, this place is a community, not a Free For All. Thanks.

 

well stormie, you might as well let this thread slide. we have gotten a whole lot of flack for a year and a half about laming, etc. if they can't let it out in this thread it will just fester....people just need to get it out in the open so they can move on.

[Rad Blackrose]

Originally posted by ryudom

i think storm and, to some degree, bakker, have a point. maybe instead of flamming the fanboys we should think of possible ways to convert them.

 

here's mine:

 

first you'd go to differant servers, and own some people up. but make sure you follow the server rules, somewhat (maybe bind a key to /say ready instead of bowing heh). anyway after you pwn them up and maybe give them some advice on their game, tell them of an upcoming tourney or ladder happening.

 

i think the key is getting them involved in some competition. i think most people on those servers are competitive, but have been brain washed with the SC. anyway it would take some work, but i'd really like to see this community turned around

 

Getting them into competition? I'm all for it.

 

Anyway, instead of trading insults and bitching about the current situation, why not get proactive, and constructive, and pull together into 'groups' to set up servers run by your own rules - then maybe we can all agree to 'stick to our own turf'. Sure, I know...not everyone's going to do that, and there will always be someone out to spoil someone else's fun...but it's a start, and there's still the kick/ban option for troublemakers.

 

Maybe it would also be a good idea to have somewhere for people to post about particular servers, with more defined sets of rules for playing on those servers. You get X amount of info when you join a server, but it's often still not enough, and doesn't take into consideration some of the 'rules of play' adopted by regulars.

 

Stormhammer, I think you're failing to see one of the main points being brought here.

 

The problem of the origional Saberist Code was that the followers wanted to maintain that level of "honor" on all servers, even on servers where there were no rules, or had rules set against them. Whenever they felt one of their rules was violated, the started kick votes, whining, the whole nine yards.

 

That is where the problem with JKII is, and where JA will also start the minute people boot up multiplayer: people will expect anyone and everyone to abide by their rules, and if they don't, they're a "****ing lamer" as so aptly put while I was in an FFA today. And this sort of behaviour will not be contained in just those regions where there are those rules. For example, I cite g// FFA's rules in summary:

 

No bitching, this is a fighting server. If you fail to fight, you will be kicked or banned. Tryouts on yadda yadda blah, etc.

 

Yet people from the fanboi community come on grendel's server constantly and raise a maelstrom of crap.

 

And even in FFA duels, don't get me started. I accepted a duel today on the Grendel server, and immediately opened a can on the person. All I got was him putting his saber away and asking, "WTF, don't you know how to duel?" I mean, what do you want me to do, hold C to an ad infinitum point of time, then proceed to inch my mouse down very slow? I was called an ass afterwards, oh bloody well.

 

My point in a nutshell is this: You can't stop the crossovers, and educating the crossovers is like talking to a brick wall: it's just not possible, and makes you look very stupid.

[Rumor]

start the conversion now: http://www.jedi-outcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9699&start=100&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

[Prime]

Originally posted by FK | unnamed

The saber off = peace crowd does just that. No matter where they go they expect others to conform to what they view as the GOD given "rules" of JK2.

This is ultimately where the bitterness against RPGers (I use the term for lack of a better one) comes from. Most rational people don't have a problem with people having dedicated RPG servers. It is when people go on public servers with no rules and get abusive when others do not follow saber down = peace. Even if just this problem was addressed, I think the community would improve drastically.

 

Originally posted by GC256

To each their own. This is a videogame by the way.

This is very true, and people need to remember that. However, it can be frustrating (for me at least) when I see that the online game has degenerated into name-calling and the spaming of moves. I see such huge potential that (IMO at least) is being wasted. JO could be one of those games that people play for many years. I think that discussing these problems (but not flaming, of course ) is a worthwhile exercise because I think JO/JA is worth the effort to try and improve.

 

Originally posted by GC256

You can't use this forum as a tool to get a census of how the majority of people play. Like you've said yourself, or someone has, most people haven't heard of this forum. (I found it just by chance). On top of that, people may not speak up with all the complaining in here (both sides).

Certainly any sort of accurate polling this way would be a waste. But even though this forum does not contain the majority of the JO community, it still likely covers a reasonable demographic. I think this thread probably provides enough evidence that there is a large percentage of the JO population that are upset about the current "honour" system.

 

Originally posted by GC256

Most servers I play in aren't basejk and/or have voting disabled, you should find servers like that.

But those non-basejk servers have really done nothing but increased the problems as far as non-RPGers (again, a general term) are concerned. IMO (perhaps too sweeping a generalization here), most mods have done precious little to improve gameplay, and have only added useless animations and emotes, and giving the admins power that the majority of them abuse. These aspects only encourage players to do anything but play the game as it was intended. I mean, were admins really that powerless with basejk (an actual question)? From what I have seen, the JO world would be a better place with just basejk.

 

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

And if you're playing 1.02, don't plan on changing your force config when you're in the first waiting to duel slot.

People still play 1.02??

 

Originally posted by GC256

By the way, thanks for speaking up Sith. There's countless more people like him and I, if you weren't so ignorant not to see it and base everything on what goes on at these forums.

Certainly there are lots of people that follow the "honour" conduct of you and SithOfDoom. But surely you don't think that those of us who are upset with this system are basing everything on what people post here. We do play the game, and we are not imagining all these things.

 

Originally posted by Obi-Wan X

While im not to much in favor of honor, if a server specifically says " Bow before each duel" or "Don't kill when saber off" then you SHOULD be kicked when you fail to follow these rules.

I agree. I am not trying to ruin anyone else's fun.

 

Originally posted by Luc Solar

I doubt I'll start playing competetively once JA comes out. I'm too much of a play-for-fun guy... I do not have the patience you need to win a drain-duel. I don't have the time needed to be actively involved in clans and matches.

Ah, someone else like me.

 

Originally posted by Chewie Bakker

his thread is both off-topic and a disgrace

A won't argue whether this thread is a disgrace or not, but I don't think this is off-topic. The discussion about the "honour" system is a big issue in JO, and potentially an even bigger one in JA. In this regard I think it is more than relavent.

 

Originally posted by ryudom

secondly, who is going to play in your server if the fanboys have imposed their ideas on all the players. thirdly, one of the points made was honor freaks coming on to others servers and kicking people that don't abid by their rules.

I've seen a lot of this too. IIRC, I've seen people kicked from their own servers.

[Luc Solar]

The whole "well why dontcha find another server"-thing does not work. It doesn't work in JO and it will not work in JA. It's not a solution to the problem. It's giving in to idiocy.

 

95% of servers have people enforcing some stupid honour-code and it spreads like a plaque.

 

Like someone pointed out in this thread: If a guy simply attacks instead of going through the saber down-bowing-charade, he is obviously a newbie who has not played the game before.

 

We all know what happens next >>> the empowered admin grips the poor newbie and yells "Hey stupid lamer n00b that's not how you're supposed to play!! If you don't [insert silly honour code] then I'll ban you. Understand, n00b!?"

 

Naturally, the newbie assumes that the rules presented by Mr. HonourJedi are the ones everyone is supposed to follow. The next day he logs on to another FFA-server and newbie2 attacks him. Newbie1 tells Newbie2 that he is a laming fag and should follow The Rules unless he wants to be kickbanned.

 

The next day both newbies (or SaberRPGn00bFanbois..what they have evolved into ) log on to a server and start "honouring" each other. Along comes Rad and Rumor. Rad kicks Newbie1 and Rumor drains Newbie2.

 

Newbie 1 & 2 start insulting the two LAMOURZASS NOOB GAYFAGGOTS who have no skill 'n play gay and are lame and complete faggots.

 

It's a plaque. It must be stopped. We must stop the people who are spreading it: The retarded clan d00ds who infest servers 24/7 and think their rules are universal. We must reach the newbies first, before they are brainwashed into believing all that honor-crap.

 

I have no pity for the fools who get flamed by "Rad's" or "Rumors"... Fanbois have deserved it, and we've deserved the right to point out their retardedness after putting up with all the BS during the JO-times.

 

[JEDI OUTCAST]

Originally posted by Luc Solar

The whole "well why dontcha find another server"-thing does not work. It doesn't work in JO and it will not work in JA. It's not a solution to the problem. It's giving in to idiocy.

 

95% of servers have people enforcing some stupid honour-code and it spreads like a plaque.

 

Like someone pointed out in this thread: If a guy simply attacks instead of going through the saber down-bowing-charade, he is obviously a newbie who has not played the game before.

 

We all know what happens next >>> the empowered admin grips the poor newbie and yells "Hey stupid lamer n00b that's not how you're supposed to play!! If you don't [insert silly honour code] then I'll ban you. Understand, n00b!?"

 

Naturally, the newbie assumes that the rules presented by Mr. HonourJedi are the ones everyone is supposed to follow. The next day he logs on to another FFA-server and newbie2 attacks him. Newbie1 tells Newbie2 that he is a laming fag and should follow The Rules unless he wants to be kickbanned.

 

The next day both newbies (or SaberRPGn00bFanbois..to what they have evolved ) log on to a server and start "honouring" each other. Along comes Rad and Rumor. Rad kicks Newbie1 and Rumor drains Newbie2.

 

Newbie 1 & 2 start insulting the two LAMOURZASS NOOB GAYFAGGOTS who have no skill 'n play gay and are lame and complete faggots.

 

It's a plaque. It must be stopped. We must stop the people who are spreading it: The retarded clan d00ds who infest servers 24/7 and think their rules are universal. We must reach the newbies first, before they are brainwashed into believing all that honor-crap.

 

I have no pity for the fools who get flamed by "Rad's" or "Rumors"... Fanbois have deserved it, and we've deserved the right to point out their retardedness after putting up with all the BS during the JO-times.

 

 

 

[Rumor]

Originally posted by JEDI OUTCAST

u r correct

 

http://www.jedi-outcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9699&start=100&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

[JEDI OUTCAST]

Originally posted by Rumor

http://www.jedi-outcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9699&start=100&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

 

 

lol.

[Rad Blackrose]

Rumor, I won't even touch that. The thread is full of oblivious idiots. At least Chewie and GC have some sense to evolve (that's credit in your direction boys, not an insult) and get with the game.

[StormHammer]

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

Getting them into competition? I'm all for it.

 

 

 

Stormhammer, I think you're failing to see one of the main points being brought here.

 

Not at all. I know exactly what issues are being raised, and some are true to my own heart. However, you can vent about the issue all you like in this thread, and trade insults with whoever you choose...but at the end of the day you will have achieved nothing. If you truly feel that the situation will not change...then by all means say so...but why continue to rant or say the same thing over and over in this thread if it's not going to solve the fundamental problem? That's like someone saying...I'll never be a millionaire, I'll never be a millionaire. So what? Deal with it and move on, and find something you can achieve.

 

As I said...it would be damned hard to try and segregate the community...people are free to roam to whichever server they choose, and play as they wish, even if it's annoying to the majority of other players. It is a very difficult and complex problem, and at the end of the day we could end up with a situation where you find some close friends and start your own password-protected server that excludes the majority of people. That would be an unfortunate thing to happen, but would potentially solve most of the problem. It's an extreme, and would be damaging to the community as a whole, but it's a solution.

 

However, I'm not willing to sit back and say nothing can be done, and the situation will simply get worse without any options for recourse. There are no perfect or permanent solutions, and no one can wave a magic wand to make the situation go away. We have to work within the confines of the problem...but I'm more optimistic that like-minded people (i.e., those who want to have some fun playing the game, from different perspectives) can find some common ground, and formulate some counter-measures to deal with the situation. Like RPers and those who really like 'Honour' codes could advertise the benefits for playing on their servers more to these wandering free spirits who can cause so much mayhem to straight frag-fighters. That won't make the problem go away, of course. There will still be those who abide by their own rules no matter what the server, and expect others to play their way.

 

That might partly be resolved if there was a CD-Key for MP play, so you could ban certain keys from your server permanently.

 

As I said before...we should be trying to find solutions, not just ranting and making ourselves feel good for 5 seconds. Let's find some lasting solutions, or at least some ideas... One thing I don't want to see is the JA online community die before it's even got off the ground.

 

Otherwise this thread really is pointless, even if it's allowing some people to get something off their chest.

 

And Luc...you can flame people all you want. Just don't do it on these forums, thanks.

[Intrepid_JKII]

You know, Edmund Burke once said

 

"All that is necessary for the triumph of noobs is that good players do nothing."

 

well.. more or less anyway

[Luc Solar]

Originally posted by StormHammer

And Luc...you can flame people all you want. Just don't do it on these forums, thanks.

 

I was only talking about "pointing out their retardedness". I believe you can do that nicely....sort of

[Rad Blackrose]

Originally posted by StormHammer

As I said...it would be damned hard to try and segregate the community...people are free to roam to whichever server they choose, and play as they wish, even if it's annoying to the majority of other players. It is a very difficult and complex problem, and at the end of the day we could end up with a situation where you find some close friends and start your own password-protected server that excludes the majority of people. That would be an unfortunate thing to happen, but would potentially solve most of the problem. It's an extreme, and would be damaging to the community as a whole, but it's a solution.

 

Damn you and your ability to predict my rebuttals!

 

However, I'm not willing to sit back and say nothing can be done, and the situation will simply get worse without any options for recourse. There are no perfect or permanent solutions, and no one can wave a magic wand to make the situation go away. We have to work within the confines of the problem...but I'm more optimistic that like-minded people (i.e., those who want to have some fun playing the game, from different perspectives) can find some common ground, and formulate some counter-measures to deal with the situation. Like RPers and those who really like 'Honour' codes could advertise the benefits for playing on their servers more to these wandering free spirits who can cause so much mayhem to straight frag-fighters. That won't make the problem go away, of course. There will still be those who abide by their own rules no matter what the server, and expect others to play their way.

 

Agreed, but part of the problem is that there are too MANY servers that cater to the "honor" crowd, and part of the blame falls on the lack of any ladder organization (TWL pulling out of TFFA, anyone?). In all of my time of playing JKII, the number of servers that do not operate for these crowds explicitly has dwindled looking from 1.02 to the present. In fact, the only servers that do operate for the sake of competition/fun without having to practically type +movedown in console are mostly clan servers. And most of the time, they do have force active.

 

Also, the introduction of adminmods (starting with VAM) has created an atmosphere of complete "control." Now while there are some admins out there that do exhibit control in a mature fashion, a good majority are in the stereotypical "13 year old whose balls haven't dropped and gets his jollies by being a bastard" category (sorry, had to say that). These are the same people who think people can be conformed to saber codes by mass /amslap, overuse of the /amsleep, etc.

 

NEWSFLASH: You're only pissing the person off.

 

If you want to operate a server with an admin mod, the only commands you should have are kick, ban, rename, status (knowing the player number is a great tool), whois, and deny/allow vote. None of this protection crap. None of this sleeping crap. Just those 7 up there is enough for an effective admin, and I hope future editions eliminate all the bullcrap to just those 7. I think the atmosphere will change a lot if that happens.

 

That might partly be resolved if there was a CD-Key for MP play, so you could ban certain keys from your server permanently.

 

I really haven't thought much of CD-Keys, especially in the case of CD-Key gens from CS.

 

As I said before...we should be trying to find solutions, not just ranting and making ourselves feel good for 5 seconds. Let's find some lasting solutions, or at least some ideas... One thing I don't want to see is the JA online community die before it's even got off the ground.

 

Here's a helmet Stormmy, get ready for the firefight.

 

And Luc...you can flame people all you want. Just don't do it on these forums, thanks.

 

But I like it when he flames!

 

EDIT: Spelling

[Rumor]

Originally posted by Rad Blackrose

Rumor, I won't even touch that. The thread is full of oblivious idiots. At least Chewie and GC have some sense to evolve (that's credit in your direction boys, not an insult) and get with the game.

 

chicken.