GinnyW Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Marek it has to have something to do with project management, lack of talent, whatever. I don't think anyone at LucasArts ever said "who the hell put action in this game? we've got to cancel it!". ROFL, no, I don't think they did that. Lack of talent is right. I'm glad this happened. I dunno who was working on it, but when a sequel is made and the original artist is absent () chances are this'll happen, or the game will be bad. The exception is MI3 I guess, though there is a point in it being not the same as the first two. I liked it though. Anyway, they'd better use this to work on S&M more, or make an original adventure (DOTT2 might be nice but only if at least one of the original artist works on it. Since Tim left, that leaves the second person who worked on it. That is, I think there was a second person. Anyway I don't remember, but if there is he should be involved at least. I'd still rather see Tim doing it, but I don't think he will with Microsoft...). Umm, Anyaywa, as I'm sure you understood, I voted yes. I wasn't very excited by the game (which the opposite of how I feel about S&M, I can't wait! ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marek Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Erwin_Br It doesn't matter how good your managment works or how creative your people are when nobody wants to play your game, or rather: when people already hate your game. Your logic is reversed. If FT2 had looked really atmospheric and exciting, there would not have been more than the usual amount of "already hate your game" sentiments. Also, I refuse to believe in the myth that action and adventure can't be combined in a more-or-less equal mix that is satisfying to both fans of FPS games and puzzle solvers. If only half the 'adventure gamers' and half the 'action gamers' like it, you've got a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Aranolorion coupled with Sam n Max 2, in adventure gaming. The focus would appear to have shifted towards action, though I still believe LA would have given us some decent puzzles. Sam & Max 2 is not an action/adventure. It's a regular adventure. At least if Mike Stemmle, the project lead on the game, and Simon Jeffery, the president of LucasArts, are to be believed. According to them, and Steve Purcell, Sam & Max 2 attempts to inject modernness into the genre by way of mini-games, not by way of forcing you to jump from ledge to ledge and beat up guys. And according to Stemmle, even many of the mini-games have alternate more adventurey puzzle solutions built into them if you get fed up with the mini-game itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingzjester Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Aranolorion The future is an inherently good thing. I venture to say it isn't. There is a huge probability that in the future we will all DIE. It is unavoidable and I don't think that my death is an inherently good thing. Also, the System of Civilizations is becoming more and more petty, cruel, dim, and capital-oriented. Through history what is generally considered a step towards enlightenment also allowed for more efficient mass murder.... I just hate sweeping generalizations such as that one. Nothing is inherently good or evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homoludens Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Um, Kingz, James had stated that in terms of adventure games, not human condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin_Br Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Marek Your logic is reversed. If FT2 had looked really atmospheric and exciting, there would not have been more than the usual amount of "already hate your game" sentiments. You're somewhat right, although you mustn't forget that there are a lot of people who don't care about exciting graphics and atmosphere. There are people who care more for story and gameplay instead. And amongst those there are a few who don't prefer action elements and can't stand games without a decent story behind it. Also, I refuse to believe in the myth that action and adventure can't be combined in a more-or-less equal mix that is satisfying to both fans of FPS games and puzzle solvers. If only half the 'adventure gamers' and half the 'action gamers' like it, you've got a winner. [/b] True, I too believe it is possible, but how are you going to convince the gamer? Full Throttle 2 could have had that equal mix but we already hated the game. Adventure gamers read 'action elements' and they think 'that's probably not my cup of tea'. Action gamers read 'adventure elements' and think the exact same thing. In short: the game was already dead. --Erwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja Dodo Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Mix action and adventure together and you'll get a game that neither the adventure fan nor the action fan wants to play.Now that's just not true. Some of the greatest adventures ever have an elegant mix of story, puzzles and action... Little Big Adventure, Outcast... and with a stretch of the definition also Gothic, Ocarina of Time and so on. Even Full Throttle has action elements. Would you say that they make it a lesser game? I'm not sure about Full Throttle 2. I didn't know enough about it to decide whether or not it was going to be good and I do regret that it's been cancelled... but from what I had seen and heard it did seem they were straying a bit too far from the grittyness of the original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted August 9, 2003 Share Posted August 9, 2003 Originally posted by Erwin_Br You're somewhat right, although you mustn't forget that there are a lot of people who don't care about exciting graphics and atmosphere. I don't think those people would have any interest in the Full Throttle series by definition really, as FT's main draw really is its atmosphere and style, not its linear predictable storyline and teensy puzzle selection, so those people shouldn't really count in this discussion . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingzjester Posted August 10, 2003 Share Posted August 10, 2003 Originally posted by Homoludens Um, Kingz, James had stated that in terms of adventure games, not human condition. Screw context, spaz! It was a general statement and those I love to butcher.... And enough with the roll-eye smileys already! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGZanthia Posted August 10, 2003 Share Posted August 10, 2003 I don't think anyone (exept for some beta testers, may be) already played thise game, and because noone ever will we'll never know how good its gameplay was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin_Br Posted August 10, 2003 Share Posted August 10, 2003 Originally posted by Ninja Dodo Now that's just not true. Some of the greatest adventures ever have an elegant mix of story, puzzles and action... Little Big Adventure, Outcast... and with a stretch of the definition also Gothic, Ocarina of Time and so on. Even Full Throttle has action elements. Would you say that they make it a lesser game? I would not say that because I personally don't mind action in advanture games. (I enjoyed really enjoyed LBA, for instance) I'm merely sharing my personal theory on why I think Full Throttle 2 wasn't acepted by many advanture gamers (or rather fans of the previous installment) which also has amongst other things got at least something to do with it's demise. Originally posted by Jake I don't think those people would have any interest in the Full Throttle series by definition really, as FT's main draw really is its atmosphere and style, not its linear predictable storyline and teensy puzzle selection, so those people shouldn't really count in this discussion I was more talking about the technical side of graphics. For example: I think many fans of the first game wouldn't at all mind if FT2 has a resolution of 320 by 200 pixels and a palette of 256 colours just like the original had. They don't care about polygon count and all that but go for the experience. The trouble with sequals often is expectation. Many people expect the sequal to be more or less the same as the original, but better. And I guess some people don't think more action combined with 3D modeled enviroments and characters displayed in higher screen resolutions will make FT2 a better game. --Erwin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wajus Posted August 11, 2003 Share Posted August 11, 2003 Originally posted by Marek It's so typical that some people on this forum have to blame the action elements for the failure of this project. Overflow of action elements over story in a story driven game is a key point here. Especially when we're talking about the sequel to one of the most classic story-telling adventure games. Edit: Besides what have Simon Jeffrey said in a press note? He didn't want to dissapoint Full Throttle fans who in general are adventure gamers. Who generally favor solid story over action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pebsmith Posted August 11, 2003 Share Posted August 11, 2003 Originally posted by Wajus Edit: Besides what have Simon Jeffrey said in a press note? He didn't want to dissapoint Full Throttle fans who in general are adventure gamers. Who generally favor solid story over action. He'd disappoint them in a second if he could have gotten twice as many non-adventure gamers to buy the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arreat Posted August 11, 2003 Share Posted August 11, 2003 How many of these full throttle threads do we need? LMAO, it seems as if we've ( excluding me of course) become FT fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remixor Posted August 11, 2003 Share Posted August 11, 2003 This exact same happened when FT2 was ANNOUNCED. Tons of threads, all saying basically the same things they're saying now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosferatu Posted August 12, 2003 Share Posted August 12, 2003 Originally posted by remixor This exact same happened when FT2 was ANNOUNCED. Tons of threads, all saying basically the same things they're saying now. Nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remixor Posted August 12, 2003 Share Posted August 12, 2003 Precisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wajus Posted August 12, 2003 Share Posted August 12, 2003 You ain't no exception here sire... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remixor Posted August 12, 2003 Share Posted August 12, 2003 I fully admit to that, too But my main point was that we've already gone through it once, and now the game no longer even exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pleto4_ryan Posted August 14, 2003 Share Posted August 14, 2003 i choosed no.... i just hope they will get it out in 2005 fixed and perfect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayfnWillmott Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 Personally, when FT2 was first announced, I was happy, and thought to myself...'Where the hell have you been all my life?". LOL. However, when they announced the action element, I know that threw a lot of people for six. The fact is, FT1 was an adventure game, sure it had action elements in it, but so did CMI, so did Sam n Max. FT2 was going to be half and half, half adventure, half action, and that never would have worked. If they wanted to attempt this, they should have made an entirely new license, an entirely new game, and gone with it. Who knows, maybe it would have been a corker of a game, a sleeper hit as it were. But calling the game Full Throttle: Hell on Wheels, with fans like you or I having the original game, it was destined to sink! It is a shame, because you can see how hard Lucasarts are trying to bring the adventure game community back to prosperity. They know their illustrious success in the past with Monkey Island, Grim Fandango et al. They know that they have a market out there for those types of games. If Sam and Max 2 isn't an indication of that, I don't know what is. I commend Lucasarts, if only for their effort. They know the genre isn't what it used to be. They know it's been overshadowed by Doom III, Half Life 2 and Quake 4, what the hell wouldn't be in this day and age!? Yet they are still trying to please us, by delivering games that we love, and have grown up with over the years! On the whole, I'd rather that this game was canned now, than have apalling sales when it finally made the market! Because that would almost certainly put people off trying to help breathe new life into this genre. I think they should definately consider Sam n Max 2 for the Xbox, GC and PS2. EMI had a decent outing on the PS2, Syberia is doing well for itself on the consoles! Sam n Max is the type of game that can draw in a big crowd with it's graphics and it's humor. Anyway, I know this is late, but I figured I wanted to add my own two pence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twifkak Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 I didn't have it in for FT2 in the slightest until I saw the screenshots. Before that, I was über-optimistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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