Revan VS. Nihilus... who would win

[Emperor Devon]

I do think that Nihilus' power takes not just a time but a long time to warm up.

 

Untrue. From what we see in Unseen, Unheard, (a comic by Chris Avellone that details the destruction of Katarr) Nihilus was able to use his power instantly. About as quickly as it takes to Force-push something, it looked like.

 

You also see him use it in-game during the confrontation on the Ravager. Saying that Kreia lied to him or 'feed on me!' will make him attempt to do so. It took him just as much time as Drain Life.

 

I mean if he could use it when ever he wanted why would he have waited so long to destroy Telos. l

 

The Ravager was quite far off from Telo's surface. I think Nihilus has to be at least in the immediate vicinity of the planet he wants to feed on to drain it.

 

As for why he didn't move closer, the space between Telos and him was filled with enemy fighters and warships. If he sent the Ravager through that, to be flanked and completely surrounded by enemies, it would've been blown to bits. He had to wait for his own forces to clear up the Republic's before he could've safely gone to Telos himself.

[SirHaxALot]

So, everyone that thinks Nihilus would win, do you believe any Jedi could defeat Nihilus, besides the Exile?

 

Refer to previous post.

[Melly]

So, everyone that thinks Nihilus would win, do you believe any Jedi could defeat Nihilus, besides the Exile?

 

No, I don't think any other Jedi or Sith could defeat Nihilus save the Exile. This is why Visas stays with the Exile, and part of the reason why Kreia sought the Exile out as well. The Exile separated herself from the Force, Nihilus' power is separating connections to the Force and feeding on the death that is a result thereof. But if the Exile has no connection to the Force how can he kill her? He even tried in that scene on the Ravager and it only weakened him. If he had tried that on any other Jedi it would have killed them, like it killed those at Katarr.

[SirHaxALot]

If that is every Nihilus supporter's opinion. Why bother debating this?

 

But honestly, I think Luke Skywalker would defeat Nihilus

[Jediphile]

So, everyone that thinks Nihilus would win, do you believe any Jedi could defeat Nihilus, besides the Exile?

 

No.

[Emperor Devon]

But honestly, I think Luke Skywalker would defeat Nihilus

 

Luke Skywalker is an extremely powerful Jedi, perhaps even the most powerful one yet. However, it does him no good - the stronger he is, the more vulnerable he is to Nihilus. He feeds upon Force-sensitives, and the stronger they are, the more he wants them. Luke would be something akin to a seven-course banquet for him.

 

Nihilus is not a Force-user in the normal sense. He relies extensively upon his draining power to be as powerful as he is - without it, he's not anything special. In terms of lightsaber combat and mastery of "regular" Force powers, both Luke and Revan would likely defeat him.

 

I don't see how anyone can argue against the power of his draining abilities, though. From what we see in the game he can use it instantly, and having a planet-wide radius it makes the numbers of his opponents irrelevant. I don't see how Luke or anyone else could stand up to that - if he can kill whole conclaves of Jedi Masters I don't think anyone else stands much of a chance.

[RedHawke]

IMHO no Jedi could defeat Nihilus... but a Sith with the correct set of Force powers... could.

 

The only being who could challenge Nihilus would have to know one of the various Force life draining techniques, and the defences one naturally gets when they possess said powers. Only then would that being be able to defeat Nihilus, who because of his mastery of the drain life power and his reliance upon it is somewhat is lacking with a lightsaber.

 

The Exile's 'wound' gave her the ability to naturally bypass Nihilus' power.

 

My 2 cents.

[Shem]

Does anybody really need to see a visual of what would happen if Darth Revan tried to take on Darth Nihilus?

 

 

There is no debate that anything else would happen. This picture is it. The death of Revan. End of story!

[Jediphile]

IMHO no Jedi could defeat Nihilus... but a Sith with the correct set of Force powers... could.

 

The only being who could challenge Nihilus would have to know one of the various Force life draining techniques, and the defences one naturally gets when they possess said powers.

 

I'm less certain about that, because the perfect example of the type of sith you seem to describe here is Traya, and she was utterly defenseless against Nihilus. We even know that she had draining techniques, since that is how she killed the jedi masters. But against Nihilus she never had a chance.

 

Only then would that being be able to defeat Nihilus, who because of his mastery of the drain life power and his reliance upon it is somewhat is lacking with a lightsaber.

 

 

The Exile's 'wound' gave her the ability to naturally bypass Nihilus' power.

 

My 2 cents.

 

Agreed.

 

EDIT: Thanks, Shem. That settles it. Case closed.

[SirHaxALot]

Ok, so this debate isn't Revan versus Nihilus. It is, any Jedi in existence versus Nihilus.

 

The most powerful jedi ever, Luke, cannot defeat him.

 

Indirect force attacks have no sway over Nihilus. Ripping apart planets, ships, blackholes...no matter, Nihilus can withstand it all.

 

Blah blah, so basically any Sith that acquires this technique is invincible?

 

You know this is a Sith technique right?

 

I doubt Nihilus is the only one to learn it. I'm sure an Exile doesn't pop up every time a Sith with this technique comes into play. And I'm sure a Sith doesn't go unchallenged for his lifetime until he consumes himself....

 

But, I'm done arguing really. I'd like to see you try and argue Nihilus > Luke in front of good ole' George XD

[GarfieldJL]

Just cause there isn't a known defense against this technique doesn't mean one doesn't exist, it's highly probable that Revan may actually know of a way to block it.

[Shem]

One thing I can compare this whole thing to off the top of my head is the X-Men movies. In X-Men III, nobody could defeat Gene Gray except Wolverine. Wolverine wasn't more powerful, but was the answer to the Gene Gray problem because he had the ability to withstand Gene Gray's attack that nobody else could. It's like how the Exile was the answer to Darth Nihilus.

 

I'm not doubting Revan is very powerful, but he/she did not have the ability to withstand Nihilus, only the Exile did. There's no shame to the Revan fan boys to admit that, even though people hate to admit a weakness in their heroes.

[SilentScope001]

Just cause there isn't a known defense against this technique doesn't mean one doesn't exist, it's highly probable that Revan may actually know of a way to block it.

 

He likely did.

 

Why else did he station Exile at Malachor V and got The Exile to cut off ties from the Force to become more powerful? Revan would never want to cut himself out from the Force, but he knows that if one does, he can defeat Nihilus, so Revan basically created The Exile. (I doubt this theory, but if it will sastify Revan lovers, here it is. I still will claim Revan "cheated" though.)

 

Ironically, however, Revan also created Darth Nihilus in the process, so this theory falls flat in the process. But it could work.

[Jae Onasi]

I like calm debates. Please make your comments calm, everyone.

[Emperor Devon]

Indirect force attacks have no sway over Nihilus. Ripping apart planets, ships, blackholes...no matter, Nihilus can withstand it all.

 

Those things would kill him. Nihilus is capable of slaying nearly any living thing, but he's still a mortal. If you stab him he bleeds. If you blast him he dies.

 

However, any living creature that tries to kill him has pretty much no chance of success of at all. With an unblockable draining power that has a planet-wide radius he can use instantly, I don't think anything would even have any time to attack to him.

[Lord Spitfire]

A minor point . . .

 

Did you know that in the beginning, Obsidian made Nihilus's mask made out of Revan's skull?

 

Does this mean anything . . .

[Titanius Anglesmith]

So, everyone that thinks Nihilus would win, do you believe any Jedi could defeat Nihilus, besides the Exile?

No.

 

I doubt Nihilus is the only one to learn it. I'm sure an Exile doesn't pop up every time a Sith with this technique comes into play. And I'm sure a Sith doesn't go unchallenged for his lifetime until he consumes himself....

There is no other Sith with this technique, so this doesn't really matter.

 

Did you know that in the beginning, Obsidian made Nihilus's mask made out of Revan's skull?

Yes, I did know that, but they took it out of the game. Therefore, it never happened.

[SilentScope001]

Did you know that in the beginning, Obsidian made Nihilus's mask made out of Revan's skull?

 

They took that out because they wanted to leave the story "open".

 

Meaning they wouldn't want people flaming them for having Revan's head chopped off.

 

On the other hand, it showed that according to Obisidan, in a one-on-one duel between Revan and Nihilus...Nihilus would be very full indeed.

[RedHawke]

I'm less certain about that, because the perfect example of the type of sith you seem to describe here is Traya, and she was utterly defenseless against Nihilus.

Perhaps... perhaps not. Kreia did everything she did for a reason, even her being defeated at that time likely served her purposes. I don't see her as ever being truely "defenseless".

 

We even know that she had draining techniques, since that is how she killed the jedi masters. But against Nihilus she never had a chance.

If Kreia were actually vulnrable to Nihilus' powers, Nihilus would have just sucked Kreia dry and been done with it, he couldn't. Kreia was more powerful than I think many would give her credit for.

 

But then Kreia was a Sith and not a Jedi.

[SilentScope001]

If Kreia were actually vulnrable to Nihilus' powers, Nihilus would have just sucked Kreia dry and been done with it, he couldn't.

 

Nihilus did. In that cutscene where Kreia is betrayed, after Nihilus force-push her, Kreia attempted to use a Force Power to grab her Lightsaber, but she was feeble and unable to do so. That's why Atris mentions that Kreia was cut off from the Force, like you were. Kreia also confirmed that she was cut off from the Force, unwillingly, thanks to Nihilus' actions.

 

I'd only speculate that Nihilus grows more powerful with time, and Kreia was betrayed quite early in Nihilus' time as a Force User, before Nihilus learnt how to gobble up planets.

[RedHawke]

Nihilus did.

Kindly point me to concrete proof of this.

 

In that cutscene where Kreia is betrayed, after Nihilus force-push her, Kreia attempted to use a Force Power to grab her Lightsaber, but she was feeble and unable to do so.

Kreia was a Sith. She had a plan, her losing at that point was most likely part of it.

 

That's why Atris mentions that Kreia was cut off from the Force, like you were. Kreia also confirmed that she was cut off from the Force, unwillingly, thanks to Nihilus' actions.

Remember Kreia was a Sith and as such her truths are laced with lies, or her lies are laced with truth. She had not 'lost' anything she had a plan and was carrying it out. That is what Sith do.

[The Architect]

Actually, not even Shem’s picture is accurate if you ask me, since Nihilus can use his power from a planet wide radius, thus Revan couldn’t get anywhere near him.

 

GarfieldJL, why is it highly probable that Revan would know a defensive technique, apart from the Exile? I beg to differ. Based on what Emperor Devon has said, I believe it’s highly unlikely Revan knows of any defensive technique apart from the Exile.

 

Anyhow, if you can theorise that an anti-Nihilus power exists, I can speculate that an anti-anti Nihilus power that Nihilus can use exists can’t I? We can go round and round with this. We should keep baseless conjecture out of such a debate.

 

@RedHawke, since I believe Jediphile’s theory about the relationship between the Exile and Darth Nihilus, assuming it’s true, back in the day Nihilus’ powers weren’t anywhere near the level they were when he devoured all life on Katarr.

 

If they were, let’s just say he would’ve had a pleasurable time in the Jedi Civil War, but he didn’t did he? I know he didn’t exist before TSL was even thought of, but what I think Obsidian did was try to “fit him in” to the story and make his existence in KotOR convincing, so one of the reasons why they created the whole “Darth Nihilus is a dark manifestation of the Exile” plot was to explain why he wasn’t eating planets in the JCW.

 

Nihilus stripped Kreia of her power, but did not kill her. As Kreia said, Sion and Nihilus chose to cast her down and make her live as a weak nobody. Obviously they thought it would be a far greater punishment than just killing her.

[GTK + JA = fun]

I think Darth Nihilus was WAY underrated in KOTOR 2, I mean he has the largest image on the front cover! You barely got to see or hear him! He was like what, defeated 3/4 through the game?? I thought he was the big boss so to speak and it turns out he is some shadowy 2nd rate bad guy almost. He was very powerful and yet the first time you meet him face to face he's a goner. When I fisrt play KOTOR 2 I liked it but I was teribly dissapointed that Nihilus was not seen as much . . . . . . with that said . . . . I voted Revan. I like Revan and I really hope Revan is in KOTOR 3 if they make that game.

 

I know I have poor knowledge/info to backup my vote but ever since I first played KOTOR I was blown away at the story of who Revan was and how it all fell into place, I found it cool that even though Revan was not in KOTOR 2 really you still heard stuff about Revan.

[SirHaxALot]

Why do people keep pitting Revan and Nihilus at a planetary-scale duel?

 

I believe the intent of the topic was just to put Revan in the Exile's shoes during their duel on the Ravager's bridge.

 

I don't care if Nihilus' power would have prevented Revan from reaching the damn bridge, we're talking about a one on one, face to face, western style duel.

 

FFS.

 

Or at least I am. And that seems like the only real way to argue this...Or wait, who would win in a duel, a pilot or a ground-trooper? Well you see...the pilot possesses the ability to fly an airplane, so before the ground-trooper could even react he would fly over him and....

 

But what if the gunner is able to find an anti-aircraft turret? Well...that wouldn't work because before the gunner could even move the jetpilot would shoot the **** out him or blow him up with his missiles....

 

Could any gunner in existence kill the pilot? No, because before any guntrooper could reach the turret, he would be shot...

 

I know it's a poor example of Nihilus vs Revan, and that I changed from ground-trooper to gunner--but you get my point.

 

Groundtrooper vs Pilot in one-on-one in hand-to-hand combat.

 

[EDIT] Revan knew of many techniques that even the most experienced Sith Master would consider dangerous. This can be exemplified through the powers taught by his Holocron to Darth Bane. One such power was the Thought Bomb, which in essence killed all force users within a great radius.

 

To say that Revan has no knowledge of Nihilus' power is somewhat rocky. He may have knowledge of it, but also, he may not know of any technique in which to defeat it. But then again, he may.

[Shem]

Actually, not even Shem’s picture is accurate if you ask me, since Nihilus can use his power from a planet wide radius, thus Revan couldn’t get anywhere near him.

Well, when is Nihilus and Revan going to be wondering on the Telos surface? The pic I made shows a visual if the two were to ever confront each other and I chose the beach because I like the scenery there.

 

When Nihilus goes planet wide with his power, usually it's because there's a lot of Force Sensitives covering the planet like Katarr. In the case of the Exile, Nihilus didn't even attempt to feed on the Exile until he/she got close enough to him.

 

And of course the reason why the Exile is the only answer against Nihilus.

 

 

 

 

 

When I fisrt play KOTOR 2 I liked it but I was teribly dissapointed that Nihilus was not seen as much . . . . . . with that said . . . . I voted Revan. I like Revan and I really hope Revan is in KOTOR 3 if they make that game.

What does voting for Revan in this poll have to do with him/her defeating Nihilus? It's like that poll I'm running this week (it's on its last day). People just vote Revan because of their fanboy love they have developled for that character without any type of thinking behind their vote.