[tsl] M4-78

[Darth InSidious]

The best way to describe this mod would probably be as the bare bones of the plot. It definitely feels like a lot of stuff is missing, partly because so much space is wasted.

 

The puzzles are largely ripped straight from Goto's Yacht. I know, I know, they were originally on M4-78, but since they were moved by the devs, some more new puzzles wouldn't have been amiss. The ones that weren't were rather easy, and the planet is incredibly short.

 

Whoever is voice-acting as Kaah was, I'm sorry to say, appalling. Wooden, slurry and unconvincing, I'm sorry to say. At first I thought the huge problems of static were simply because of the computerising that the voice was meant to have, but it became apparent that it was simply low-quality audio. ES-05 was also very hard to understand at times, due to speaking too fast and not enunciating clearly enough, I thought. M4-78 was just hard because of the static.

 

The dialogue was frequently single-option-only, at most, three options given, which was disappointing, and often contained grammatical quirks or spelling errors.

 

The business with L5-65 in the Central Zone was perhaps the most badly made part. First of all, the explanation of the system is distinctly unclear, and seems to imply that the power generators need to be activated. Secondly, no explanation is given of why this is. Third, there is no journal entry for this, so checking back about it proves difficult. Finally, once the puzzle is complete, there is a horrendous animated camera that zooms in from miles around the back of the model, showing untextured parts, and clipping through about a dozen walls.

 

There's also a paucity of journal entries after the first quest that adds to the half-done feel of the mod.

 

Overall, plot-light, fight-light, dialogue-light...Given the hype, I expected more.

 

Sorry, DSTONEY, but it's a 5/10 from me on technical execution.

[Quatra]

I need to edit some .wav files for Kreia. I do have some plans for adding something either on the landing arm or on the Hawk after that scene.

 

sounds good

[Sith Holocron]

. . . the huge problems of static were simply because of the computerising that the voice was meant to have, but it became apparent that it was simply low-quality audio. . . . M4-78 was just hard because of the static.

 

Is anyone else hearing the audio problems, static-wise?

[Totenkopf]

Don't recall static, but rather some reverberation. Also, noticed that you can get some kind of an exp loop w/ES-05. By constantly trying to talk to it you can continue to rack up 2000 exp pts every time it responds (got up to 14000 before moving on).

[DarthStoney]

Apparently same issue with IS-24 I will add ti list of fixes.

[The Source]

The best way to describe this mod would probably be as the bare bones of the plot. It definitely feels like a lot of stuff is missing, partly because so much space is wasted.

 

The puzzles are largely ripped straight from Goto's Yacht. I know, I know, they were originally on M4-78, but since they were moved by the devs, some more new puzzles wouldn't have been amiss. The ones that weren't were rather easy, and the planet is incredibly short.

 

Whoever is voice-acting as Kaah was, I'm sorry to say, appalling. Wooden, slurry and unconvincing, I'm sorry to say. At first I thought the huge problems of static were simply because of the computerising that the voice was meant to have, but it became apparent that it was simply low-quality audio. ES-05 was also very hard to understand at times, due to speaking too fast and not enunciating clearly enough, I thought. M4-78 was just hard because of the static.

 

The dialogue was frequently single-option-only, at most, three options given, which was disappointing, and often contained grammatical quirks or spelling errors.

 

The business with L5-65 in the Central Zone was perhaps the most badly made part. First of all, the explanation of the system is distinctly unclear, and seems to imply that the power generators need to be activated. Secondly, no explanation is given of why this is. Third, there is no journal entry for this, so checking back about it proves difficult. Finally, once the puzzle is complete, there is a horrendous animated camera that zooms in from miles around the back of the model, showing untextured parts, and clipping through about a dozen walls.

 

There's also a paucity of journal entries after the first quest that adds to the half-done feel of the mod.

 

Overall, plot-light, fight-light, dialogue-light...Given the hype, I expected more.

 

Sorry, DSTONEY, but it's a 5/10 from me on technical execution.

Lol... Tell me Darth Insidious, was your first mod perfection? Lol... I know he asked for feedback. Yes, this mod has several issues that need to be addressed; however, not many first time storyarch mods are successful. I have had my few bangs and bruises.

 

DSTONEY, the bottom line is quite simple. Don't try to please a community of indivisduals who believe they are god's gift to modding. I think you did a great start. Since you are pretty new to the whole storyarch ideology, I can see what and where you may need some help. My very first story mod was short, pointless, and illogical. If I stopped to consider how others would have done it, I would only be pleasing the community as a whole. Use this mod as a learning tool, or just have fun with the whole thing. I personally believe that this is a great start to something that can become a unique piece of work. If the voice-overs are not working out, I wouldn't worry about adding them in. When you read any type of novel, your thoughts fill in the voices and images. Allow your audience to develop their own set of internal voiceovers.

 

At the end of the day, do something for yourself. Allow this mod to please you, and don't worry about any negative critics. Have fun with this mod. Do this for yourself and no one else. Remember, this is only a gamming community, and you will meet absolutely no one from these forums in real life. So, relax and have fun.

[Inyri]

At the end of the day, do something for yourself. Allow this mod to please you, and don't worry about any negative critics. Have fun with this mod. Do this for yourself and no one else. Remember, this is only a gamming community, and you will meet absolutely no one from these forums in real life. So, relax and have fun.

Here, let me translate:

 

Lulz don't listen to DI because I don't like him and I love your mod, so don't fix it in any way because it's fine the way it is.

 

Really... how is that helpful to any author?

[The Source]

Here, let me translate:

 

Lulz don't listen to DI because I don't like him and I love your mod, so don't fix it in any way because it's fine the way it is.

 

Really... how is that helpful to any author?

Quite the reverse. Darth Insidious is a great modder, and I give him my highest respect. The general statement I was going for is simple: Since this is not something that will be used for a resume, he should just enjoy playing around. If he was a professional author, I don't think he would be asking us for an opinion.

[Inyri]

And since he's asking for our opinion, you should really let people give theirs instead of trying to take immature shots at them.

[Quanon]

If he was a professional author, I don't think he would be asking us for an opinion.

 

Hmm, Isn't that putting a lot of people in an ivory tower mind set...

 

I think anyone can have some critique. I don't find DI's post that offensive or overly Negative.

 

"Wooow" and "OMG this is a great mod'" post are fun to get when you release a mod.

 

DI's kind of post is far more informative on what you can do to polish your mod to a better version.

 

Besides after playing a part of this mod, I'm convinced that DSTONEY is able to take it to higher heights

 

Plus this ain't rooky/ beginner stuff to start with.

 

Anyway, I'm just happy to see my Droid talk and gaze on my Skybox

Yeah, I'm ego-tripping here

[The Source]

And since he's asking for our opinion, you should really let people give theirs instead of trying to take immature shots at them.

Inyri,

One of the greatest challanges in writting in forums or email is the projection of emotions. When an individual writes a statement, sometimes it can be translated from multiple perspectives. Read what was stated above. If you notice what I have written, I mostly used words of encouragement. I tried to remined my friend Darth Insidious about our origins as modders. He does give great advice, but I personally believe that modding is for fun. Over analyzing information is a useless gesture. We are not American Idol. There are no winners of losers.

 

Hmm, Isn't that putting a lot of people in an ivory tower mind set...

Reality stinks, doesn't it? Lol...

[jonathan7]

Inyri,

One of the greatest challanges in writting in forums or email is the projection of emotions. When an individual writes a statement, sometimes it can be translated from multiple perspectives. Read what was stated above. If you notice what I have written, I mostly used words of encouragement. I tried to remined my friend Darth Insidious about our origins as modders. He does give great advice, but I personally believe that modding is for fun. Over analyzing information is a useless gesture. We are not American Idol. There are no winners of losers.

 

I disagree, DSTONEY642000 is still working on M4-78, and I think criticism such as DI's is useful, as I would think he would want to intergrate M4-78 as closely as he can to the original storyline. That said I do concur you should mod for fun, and it is a bad idea to try and please everyone, as people obviously have different ideas voer what should happen. However to improve in anything constructive criticism is very important; Personally I think DSTONEY642000 will want to try and release as faithful to the original as he can; as such I think criticisms such as DI's give him the opportunity to change things. Just my 2 cents.

[The Source]

I disagree, DSTONEY642000 is still working on M4-78, and I think criticism such as DI's is useful, as I would think he would want to intergrate M4-78 as closely as he can to the original storyline. That said I do concur you should mod for fun, and it is a bad idea to try and please everyone, as people obviously have different ideas voer what should happen. However to improve in anything constructive criticism is very important; Personally I think DSTONEY642000 will want to try and release as faithful to the original as he can; as such I think criticisms such as DI's give him the opportunity to change things. Just my 2 cents.

Outside of Darth Insidious's opinion, I think everyone else is taking this too serious. I am telling DSTONEY to enjoy himself, and you people are acting like this is a job. Creative critisim is useful, but this is only a games forum.

 

DSTONEY,

You are doing fine man. Just keep tinkering. Once you see what has been envisioned, allow yourself to enjoy the work you've done. Don't allow perfection to overwhelm you. Again, this is a great beginning.

[90SK]

When you're making a mod, you want to use the base game as your standard for quality. And if certain aspects of the mod don't meet those standards, you should expect to get some criticism.

 

I think this is a good mod. I mean, from what I've seen of it: I haven't actually played it through yet, but I can tell that you put a lot of time and effort into it. However, it doesn't strike me as being "game-quality" yet. There are definite improvements you could make. DI's post may not be buttered up, but it's still valid and should be taken into consideration. You've done good work with making a mod, but anyone can do that, you know? I'm not trying to deny you the credit for doing a LOT of work, but the work that you did isn't necessarily on par with what's in the game already.

 

You're adding a new planet, and that's going to take a lot of time and effort to execute properly. You're off to a good start, but you really should aim for a higher mark in future releases, you know?

[The Source]

When you're making a mod, you want to use the base game as your standard for quality. And if certain aspects of the mod don't meet those standards, you should expect to get some criticism.

That is just fluff. He is not the game developer. When it comes to expectations, modders should meet their own personal expectations. If a person has a high standard, they should only feel obligated to themselves to meet that standard. Modders should only be doing this for fun and entertainment.

[jonathan7]

Modders should only be doing this for fun and entertainment.

 

This seems a little presumptious, as in, when modding the end result is what I am aiming for, I don't find the intermediate too fun, but I look forward to the fruits of what I'm doing. I would suspect this would be true of TG's efforts, and indeed I would suspect any long term mod that succeeds would adhere to this.

 

I also agree with 90SK, that really a good mod, blends seemlessly into a game.

[The Source]

This seems a little presumptious, as in, when modding the end result is what I am aiming for, I don't find the intermediate too fun, but I look forward to the fruits of what I'm doing. I would suspect this would be true of TG's efforts, and indeed I would suspect any long term mod that succeeds would adhere to this.

 

I also agree with 90SK, that really a good mod, blends seemlessly into a game.

As long as the individual is seeking a personal goal of gradification, the logical end they should be seeking is for entertainment purposes. If an individual is seeking a job as a game developer, they should only be seeking the opinion of fellow developers.

 

Team-Gizka's flaws and pros are not for this thread, so we should reframe from conversing in here about them.

 

Lets get back on track.

[90SK]

That is just fluff. He is not the game developer. When it comes to expectations, modders should meet their own personal expectations. If a person has a high standard, they should only feel obligated to themselves to meet that standard. Modders should only be doing this for fun and entertainment.

 

Nonsense. Fun is one thing, but if you're releasing a mod to the public, you have an obligation to do your best and make the mod as good as possible. If you aren't releasing the mod, sure, screw quality: do it for the enjoyment.

 

The fact of the matter is, most modders make mods so they can release them. Sure, they SHOULD have fun with it, but ultimately the point of modding is to improve the game and to RELEASE those improvements.

 

In order to improve the game your standards need to be on the same level as the developers.

[Quanon]

Lets get back on track.

 

Indeed, highjacking a release thread

 

I think the source has a point, there's no reason into pushing people to hard,

Its all about the fun in creating stuff.

 

And like mentioned before, we all view quality differant. Its ofcourse not a bad thing to improve a mod.

 

But it should stay fun for the "modder"/ creator.

 

Anyway, I'm not sure where a thread on this kind of subject fits

Its actually kind if interresting.

 

Though I'll now let it rest and awaits DSTONEYs reply.

[Totenkopf]

The business with L5-65 in the Central Zone was perhaps the most badly made part. First of all, the explanation of the system is distinctly unclear, and seems to imply that the power generators need to be activated. Secondly, no explanation is given of why this is. Third, there is no journal entry for this, so checking back about it proves difficult. Finally, once the puzzle is complete, there is a horrendous animated camera that zooms in from miles around the back of the model, showing untextured parts, and clipping through about a dozen walls.

 

I was sort of lost about the point of L5-65. The power stations were all active when I entered that area and I'm not even sure what puzzle DI is referring to here b/c I don't recall encountering it. Your read me referred to a puzzle at the environment door that I apparently never found, even though I was able to make it all the way to M4-78 in spite of that. In some ways the mod feels like GOTO's yacht writ large and in an open area (all those mines, droids and turrets). Also, as someone pointed out I think, perhaps you can address the lack of follow through to the cutscene in the EH where they think the Exile is dead. Overall, though, a nice effort that fleshes the somewhat skeletal TSL a little more. As to the voice acting, oh well....I've not found a mod yet that had vo that weren't somewhat amateurish or at least uneven (some sounding natural/others stilted).

[Sith Holocron]

I was sort of lost about the point of L5-65. The power stations were all active when I entered that area and I'm not even sure what puzzle DI is referring to here b/c I don't recall encountering it.

 

Other examples abound. I was in the process of writing a walk-through (attempting for the style of Game Banshee's walk-through) when I discovered some plot difficulties that Totenkopf and others have described. I imagine Darth Stoney's mod will eventually represent a complete cohesive whole that won't detract from the TSL experience as a whole. I look forward to continued constructive criticism until it gets to that point.

 

I was wondering if some of the modders that might be more familiar with USM would be making suggestions to Stoney about making this mod USM compatible - in addition to the other various items that need improving?

 

I'm going to let the modders chat away about this because I don't have any real modding experience. (I just install them!)

[JCarter426]

Hmm...well, the only part of the mod I can think of that would be incompatible with USM would be the changes to T3-M4's dialogue. And that's pretty easy to fix; just take the edited dialogue file from USM and make the necessary changes (after getting permission, of course ). Then include that in addition to the original, for those that have USM installed. This might not be the only thing, though; I don't have USM installed anymore, so I don't remember exactly which files it edits (though I'm certain that T3-M4's dialogue is one of them).

 

While we're on the topic of mod compatibility, I had a slight problem with one of the journal entries; the text was the description of Coruscant from the Jedi Temple mod (Terrain: Cityscape, Docking: Jedi Temple, etc.). I actually didn't think I still had the Jedi Temple mod installed at the time, but I guess I did. I'm not exactly sure what caused this...

[Darth InSidious]

Lol... Tell me Darth Insidious, was your first mod perfection?

No, no it wasn't. But then, I didn't promise the Earth - or at least, a planet - in the first place.

 

Lol... I know he asked for feedback. Yes, this mod has several issues that need to be addressed; however, not many first time storyarch mods are successful. I have had my few bangs and bruises.

Relevance?

DSTONEY, the bottom line is quite simple. Don't try to please a community of indivisduals who believe they are god's gift to modding.

 

Mr. Kettle? There's a Mr. Pot outside, waiting to talk to you about colour-schemes...

The general statement I was going for is simple: Since this is not something that will be used for a resume, he should just enjoy playing around. If he was a professional author, I don't think he would be asking us for an opinion.

So, because it isn't a professional piece of work, the author should not get accurate feedback and should put in no effort?

[RedHawke]

Lets get back on track.

Agreed...

 

Guys, your convo is quite off topic for this thread... please take it to PM's.

Back on topic folks, don't make me get my axe out...

[Totenkopf]

Has anyone had a problem with this mod affecting gameplay on NS? If not this one, then perhaps the Telos slums mod? Have ~5 or 6 mods in OR folder and notice that when I go to Nar Shaada after M4-78 I get all kinds of irregularities (goto's yacht, the JJT sequence, mira, etc...).