Return to Monkey Island

[Alexrd]

Speaking of the art style, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we got a toggle to switch between modern and pixel art.

[MurraySchull]

14 hours ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

Personally I'm not over the moon about the new art style (albeit from the limited glimpses we've seen of it). And I'm biased because I LOVE Purcell's and Chan's work (I have a Purcell print hanging in my hallway). The two shots we've seen remind me of the first Special Edition, so that's triggering some trauma by itself. However looking at Rex Crowle's other art makes me worry less: His work is great! Definitely got his own style. And I'm already warming to the look in the trailer, so maybe it's all going to be OK!

 

I wouldn't worry too much. It's a lot more lively than the MI1SE by the animation alone, which is much more flowing and stylised than something like MI1SE, which was 1:1 in terms of animation frames, which works for pixel art but not so much a HD restoration. There's a much nicer marriage between the animation and the still graphics of RMI.

And re. if the character up on deck might be Guybrush... the number of times that he walks back and forth, and seeing that concept art on the previous page, I'm thinking it might be! It is a "teaser trailer" after all. I'm not in love with that original concept design as it's pretty abstract compared to his other appearances. I hope he'll at least be more recognisable as the same character visually in the actual game.

Also wasn't Mojo's 2003 April Fools gag entitled Return to Monkey Island? It's come full circle!

[Lagomorph01]

53 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

And I hope to fuck Gilbert has gotten the “a non ending is a great ending” thing out of his system. It ruined Thimbleweed Park. 

Couldn't disagree more! I loved Thimbleweed Park and absolutely adored the ending! I don't know if it's what I want from this game though... but we'll see.

[MurraySchull]

27 minutes ago, OzzieMonkey said:

What if...we get a mix of post Tales continuation and a conclusion to Ron's story through dimension hopping and time travel. Maybe Murray is the key to that, hopping from the post-Curse canon to the end of MI2 to bridge the gaps. Maybe that's all too much and too contrived/lore-heavy for this series, idk. Depends on how it's done. Either way, I have faith in Ron. 

I've got it! The game begins with a cutscene. Guybrush is at the Big Whoop carnival. He becomes lost. The Voodoo Lady appears, telling him he has the option to turn left or turn right. His choice in this moment will change his destiny.

"And... what happens if I turn left?"
"You'll find the Big Whoop dodgems. Be careful! I hear one of them is not securely fastened!"
...
"Uh huh. And what if I turn right?"
"Who knows..."
...
"Sounds cool! I'll take it!"

The game begins.

[Spiketheclown]

49 minutes ago, Alexrd said:

Speaking of the art style, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we got a toggle to switch between modern and pixel art.

Hell yeah, I want "nice big juicy icons full of pixels", as Ron said in 2013!

[Rum Rogers]

1 hour ago, Alexrd said:

Speaking of the art style, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we got a toggle to switch between modern and pixel art.

Hmm maybe just as a shader-made easter egg, but definitely not with the care we are used to (Mark Ferrari). The art direction is pretty clear and to have proper pixel art for Monkey Island, you'd have to hire completely different directors and sets of artists (not to mention animators).

Edited April 5, 2022 by Rum Rogers

[Bagge]

2 hours ago, Alexrd said:

I was hoping that Ron could do his sequel without having to worry about the baggage established in the spin-off games (that's what I call Curse, Escape and Tales), which don't reflect his vision.

It does seems like a tough balancing act to both provide Ron Gilbert's original vision for what happens after the MI2 ending, and accomodate the info dump in the LeChuck conversation towards the end of CMI at the same time. I guess we'll see - I have a lot of confidence in Ron Gilbert.

[Udvarnoky]

Assuming that Ron has been given creative carte blanche on this game, then everything in it is of course "his vision," including any acknowledgments of the sequels he decides to incorporate.

[Bagge]

8 minutes ago, Udvarnoky said:

everything in it is of course "his vision,"

 

Hence "original vision". But, as I said, I'm sure Ron will find a way to make it work.

 

36 minutes ago, Rum Rogers said:

Hmm maybe just as a shader-made easter egg, but definitely not with the care we are used to (Mark Ferrari). The art direction is pretty clear and to have proper pixel art for Monkey Island, you'd have to hire completely different directors and sets of artists (not to mention animators).

 

I agree. I could see them doing a pixelated filter as a nod to the special editions, but I doubt they would do two complete sets of every background and character in the game.

[Lagomorph01]

42 minutes ago, Bagge said:

It does seems like a tough balancing act to both provide Ron Gilbert's original vision for what happens after the MI2 ending, and accomodate the info dump in the LeChuck conversation towards the end of CMI at the same time. I guess we'll see - I have a lot of confidence in Ron Gilbert.

Didn’t Escape from Monkey Island majorly screw this up already?

[ThunderPeel2001]

I think Ron got the pixel thing out if his system with TWP. It was a love letter to pixels. (Which was nice, but now it’s been done.)  Hopefully the same is true of in jokes. I like in jokes, but I felt bludgeoned by them in TWP. 

It’s:
 

1. Love your characters 

2. Story above all else 

3. Don’t be afraid of emotional moments 

 

Not:

 

1. Don’t bother with characters 

2. Story doesn’t really matter

3. Cram with in-jokes in lieu of not having the above two things 

 

Oh boy. It’s going to be a long slog thinking about this stuff until release day 🤣

Edited April 5, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[ThunderPeel2001]

1 minute ago, Lagomorph01 said:

Didn’t Escape from Monkey Island majorly screw this up already?

EMI created a plot hole regarding Herman Toothrot. I remember that. 

[Lagomorph01]

3 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

EMI created a plot hole regarding Herman Toothrot. I remember that. 

Yeah, but I mean the whole state of Monkey Island in Escape is a plot hole, right? Dinky Island leads to Monkey Island, and Big Whoop was build on Monkey Island. You can even see the Giant Monkeyhead having a death coaster going in it's mouth in Curse. (You can even see it in the above image.)

Or did LeChuck break the amusement park down before that stupid church was built?

Edited April 5, 2022 by Lagomorph01

[ThunderPeel2001]

1 minute ago, Lagomorph01 said:

Yeah, but I mean the whole state of Monkey Island in Escape is a plot hole, right? Dinky Island is in connection to Monkey Island, and that's where Big Whoop was build. You can even see the Giant Monkeyhead having a death coaster going in it's mouth in Curse. (You can even see it in the above image.)

Or did LeChuck break the amusement park down before that stupid church was built?

I don’t know. I feel you can probably choose to ignore specifics in the Carnival of the Damned given the voodoo stuff surrounding it. 
 

I need to watch that CMI info dump again though. 

[Bagge]

1 minute ago, Lagomorph01 said:

Yeah, but I mean the whole state of Monkey Island in Escape is a plot hole, right? Dinky Island leads to Monkey Island, and Big Whoop was build on Monkey Island. You can even see the Giant Monkeyhead having a death coaster going in it's mouth in Curse. (You can even see it in the above image.)

Or did LeChuck break the amusement park down before that stupid church was built?

Unlike CMI and TMI, EMI played it very loose with established Monkey Island characters, tone and canon. I think it’s a perfectly fine adventure game in its own right, but I don’t particularly like it as a Monkey Island sequel.

[Rum Rogers]

39 minutes ago, Bagge said:

I think it’s a perfectly fine adventure game in its own right, but I don’t particularly like it as a Monkey Island sequel.

This 1000 times. Great adventure game, just a sub par (and screwed up) sequel.

[Lagomorph01]

46 minutes ago, Bagge said:

I think it’s a perfectly fine adventure game in its own right, but I don’t particularly like it as a Monkey Island sequel.

I agree wholeheartedly too! It's a fun adventure game, but especially the second half is brutal to Monkey Island lore...

 

On another note, I just saw his Wikipedia, and it states Earl Boen has retired from voice acting in 2017. I'm so hoping he'll make an exception for LeChuck! He's fantastic in the role, and nobody but him ever sounded 'right' to me!

It would be especially cringy to have someone else voice the part if Return is indeed a 'midquel' between Revenge and Curse.

Edited April 5, 2022 by Lagomorph01

[Udvarnoky]

58 minutes ago, Bagge said:

I think it’s a perfectly fine adventure game in its own right, but I don’t particularly like it as a Monkey Island sequel.

 

What's funny about this sentiment is that I read it so many times about CMI in the old days. I'm not saying EMI is going to eventually get some dramatic reassessment, but it's interesting how these things work.

[MurraySchull]

I never got on the EMI hate train. It may not fit 100% alongside the canon of the rest of the series, but I've always enjoyed playing it and think it's a great game and story in its' own right. The music and voice acting especially is as pitch perfect as any of the games have been, and there's still more than enough positives in the writing and humour for me to enjoy replaying it every so often.

[Udvarnoky]

There are dozens of us!

[ThunderPeel2001]

There's definitely things I really enjoyed about EMI, I do think it's unfairly maligned sometimes. But it was also really lacking in the usual MI atmosphere. The world felt cold and empty compared to previous games. And the ending went off the rails... but it would be a lie to say that I didn't spend most of my time enjoying it.

[Bagge]

2 minutes ago, Udvarnoky said:

 

What's funny about this sentiment is that I read it so many times about CMI in the old days. I'm not saying EMI is going to eventually get some dramatic reassessment, but it's interesting how these things work.

Sure, but CMI and EMI were released so close in time that I don't think age is a factor in reassessment at this point, at least. Feels crazy to me that it has been 25 years and 22 years, respectively!

 

Incidentally, despite how much I love the game, I kinda sorta slightly still feel the same way about CMI, but to a much lesser degree than EMI.

[MurraySchull]

29 minutes ago, Udvarnoky said:

There are dozens of us!

There's literally more than 30! (probably)

 

I find it kind-of interesting that CMI & EMI were the harder games to find 10-12 years ago due to them being out of print physically and not being available digitally yet, not even when the iron was hot after the release of the Special Editions and Tales.

 

Then in a twist of fate recent years, Tales became the hardest game to find after Telltale's closure and its' disappearance from various platforms. I believe it may have only been available through physical means for a short while, and even then only via the likes of eBay, etc. Eventually it came back to digital platforms on PC at least.

Edited April 5, 2022 by fentongames

[Lagomorph01]

I get what people say about CMI, and I understand the sentiment. But that game gets a pass from me because of everything it puts to the table. The art style, animation, cinematography, atmosphere, humour, voice acting (which was a first), music and everything was so top notch, not to mention it had to start from the point where Ron left it, (which must've been really hard).

CMI has the disadvantage of not being made by the original creator, but makes up for it in all other fields. EMI... not so much.

[Romão]

Atmosphere, that magical combination of sense of place and evocative music, that lingering feeling that still thrives years after playing the games, that was always my main takeaway from the monkey Island series.

 

And it's in that sense that the first three games excel and the other two falter, regardless of any plot holes or lore breaking elements that were never as important to me