Pavlos Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Source Hidden away at the bottom of a (mostly mundane) interview with Kotaku, lead designer of KotOR II, Chris Avellone, has shed some more light on the nature of the "True Sith" mentioned throughout the game, revealing them to be the "survivors of Naga Sadow’s empire". "They were survivors of Naga Sadow’s empire. Much like the Shadows in Babylon 5, they were orchestrating the collapse of the Republic from behind the scenes, interfering with key events to cause echoes through the Force and leave it ripe for invasion – hopefully without a shot even being fired. In essence, they were changing the shape of the galaxy through manipulation of specific people and conflicts, much like Sidious did, but on an even larger scale than Episode 1 through 3. The idea was that in Knights of the Old Republic II, Revan slowly became aware of this underlying threat (because Revan is a tactical badass) and went off to seek out the true source of the threat to the galaxy. This was why he was trying to keep the Old Republic infrastructure intact so he could use it against the Sith. Anyway. Fairy tales and legends and what might have been, but that was the intent, yes." Looks like he wasn't kidding when he said that what was happening in TSL was simply a small part of the larger picture. It's quite literally a scaled-down version of his larger plot ideas... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salzella Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 awesome, aside from the Naga Sadow survivors thing, that's almost exactly how i envisaged the true sith. avellone thinks like i do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabretooth Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 echoes AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrrtoken Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I knew that it would be something like in the first place. Now, I just hope BioWare keeps the True Sith to their original context in TOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Char Ell Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Nice find Pavlos. From what I can tell TOR looks poised to continue that theme but I'm curious what prompted Mr. Avellone to reveal this now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shem Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 That is so cool! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TKA-001 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I knew that it would be something like in the first place. Now, I just hope BioWare keeps the True Sith to their original context in TOR. I doubt they will, since the "True Sith" in TOR seem to all be human or near-human for some reason. they were changing the shape of the galaxy through manipulation of specific people and conflicts, much like Sidious did, but on an even larger scale than Episode 1 through 3. (Emphasis mine) Bull****. These Sith were manipulating the Republic on a larger scale and more closely than the Sith who became leader of the Republic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vougalot Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 The ironic thing is that this was what most people immediately thought the "true Sith" would turn out to be back in 2004, and it was quickly dismissed as too simple and unlikely. Most fans thought something more complicated and creative would be revealed and began to theorize endlessly as to what that may have been. To top it off, Obsidian said that they intended the enigmatic "true Sith" to be an entirely different geographical group from the Empire of Ajunta Pall, Marka Ragnos, et. al. (which would mean either that they were lying then or they're lying now about this having been the intention all along). And now it turns out that the "true Sith" come from the most obvious and unimaginative connection to Star Wars lore that everyone was quick to dismiss because there were just so many better theories out there. I, for one, can't help but feel disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarsityPuppet Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 It is pretty unimaginative. I was expecting something/someone completely unknown. All we get now is Naga Sadow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vougalot Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Plus the fact that their goal is no different from that of the other Sith: destroy the Jedi, destroy the Republic, rule the galaxy. I thought the message Kreia tried to convey that these guys thought differently; that they got the right idea whereas the other Sith were completely missing the boat? Now they don't seem any different other than the fact that they come from a different lineage. My theory - that they were the remnants of Adas' pre-Republic empire, having nothing to do with the fallen Jedi who would later conquer those they left behind on Korriban and Ziost, and who are bent on destroying the Sith order who dared to intermingle their blood with that of the exiled Jedi, caring nothing for the Jedi or the Republic - was way better. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blix Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Ah interesting, it seems like most of us who guessed it would be remnants of the Sadow Sith were correct My only question is if this "true sith" plot is supposed to be on a much larger scale than Sidious' (which was pretty damn large considering Clone Wars/Order 66/Empire/etc.) is how did they plot for so long without ever being discovered or stopped? I'm guessing that the True Sith are already in control or at least have made themselves known by the settings of TOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ztalker Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Ah interesting, it seems like most of us who guessed it would be remnants of the Sadow Sith were correct My only question is if this "true sith" plot is supposed to be on a much larger scale than Sidious' (which was pretty damn large considering Clone Wars/Order 66/Empire/etc.) is how did they plot for so long without ever being discovered or stopped? I'm guessing that the True Sith are already in control or at least have made themselves known by the settings of TOR. Who built the Malachor 5 Temple? Who created the teaching that made Kreia, Sion en Nihilus Sith Lord? I think there presence was always there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharen Thrawn Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I knew that it would be something like in the first place. Now, I just hope BioWare keeps the True Sith to their original context in TOR. Honestly, I do not see it comming. When I wrote this question on Kotaku, I actually wasn't expecting MCA to answer that the True Sith were indeed the Great Hyperspace survivors. But the explanation on how they would return trully surprised me in a positive way. Avellone's vision of the True Sith's comeback is closely connected to the concept of wounds and echoes in the Force hugely present in KOTOR 2. It's complex and actually very subtle. Seeing how BioWare seems to pretend TSL doesn't exist and based on what we know so far about TOR, I think the True Sith's comeback in TOR will be just a military assault prolonged by decades of building a fleet and an army. I think they will cut the plan of "deafening" the Galaxy by causing echoes and wounds in the Force. I just don't see epiCness-loving BioWare implementing Avellon's subtle way of the Sith conquering the Republic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blix Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Who built the Malachor 5 Temple? Who created the teaching that made Kreia, Sion en Nihilus Sith Lord? I think there presence was always there... We all know that the Dark Side of the force has been in existence for years, and that obviously the original Sith were the first users of such practices. Cryptics aside, what I am asking is how were the "True Sith" able to live in selclusion for so long to scheme the fate of the Jedi without being stopped? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharen Thrawn Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 We all know that the Dark Side of the force has been in existence for years, and that obviously the original Sith were the first users of such practices. Cryptics aside, what I am asking is how were the "True Sith" able to live in selclusion for so long to scheme the fate of the Jedi without being stopped? The same way how the Sith Triumvirate managed to lead their silent war against the Jedi for so long which was by creating wounds in the Force to "deafen" the Galaxy and the Jedi. It's all there, explained in KOTOR 2 and as it seems now, these teachings and techniques came from the True Sith Kreia discovered on Malachor V. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ping Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 So the identity of the True Sith is finally confirmed, eh? TBH, I've never had a doubt in my mind that the True Sith were the Great Hyperspace War survivors. I mean, you don't really have to think about it too much, as the Sith used to be an alien species, and it would be pretty darn hard to find a truer Sith then the Sith species. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredi Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 It's nice to know this info, This is what I was expecting as well, is good to know we are going the right direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pavlos Posted June 3, 2009 Author Share Posted June 3, 2009 As Sharen mentioned, it's not so much the exact identity that's interesting (I don't mean to be modernist about it but if the True Sith had been the descendants of Tony Jaa it wouldn't have had that great an effect on how good the game was) but rather that MCA intelligently placed the elements for the sequel in KotOR II's plot -- ready for their significance to be "activated" in the player's mind by moments of exposition in the next game -- and the idea of people manipulating galactic events from behind the scenes; people whose method of manipulation rather makes Kreia's echoes and precise choice of actions at critical moments look like child's play. Edit: Cheers for asking the question, Sharen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Vougalot Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 We all know that the Dark Side of the force has been in existence for years, and that obviously the original Sith were the first users of such practices. There were dark side practitioners long before the Sith. To my knowledge, the Rakata are chronologically the first known darksiders to date. And yeah, everyone here seems to have seen the Great Hyperspace War connection coming from miles away. That's my point: they let us down by taking the most obvious road; the one we all expected. A little more imagination would have gone a long way. You certainly could have had "truer" Sith than those from the Great Hyperspace War because they were not pure-blooded Sith but intermingled with the blood and practices of the Dark Jedi. My idea (I hate to boast but it's the only example I can come up with) would have presented a completely pure line of Sith entirely untouched and completely foreign to their later Dark Jedi conquerers. That way, their quest for revenge could have been directed at the Sith "infadels" (the Sith Order, as it bastardized the Sith culture by being assimilated by the Dark Jedi) instead of wanting to kill the Jedi and the Republic like always. It would have been something new and fresh. Sorry, I tend to ramble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedHawke Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH You know you love the echoes! They pwn j00! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamqd Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Them just being descendants of the old Sith Empire is what I thought from the Start tbh. It's ok saying they were making moves bigger than Sidious... But he was one man (He said the Sith of EP I-III, not the Order of Bane as a whole FTR) and obviously had a larger effect on the Galaxy than these now defunct conjectural people. I'm sure Bioware will make good of what Avellone planned TSL to add to the Story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltiades Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Yeah, I think most knew what the True Sith were, in an overall sense. I didn't mind that, Avellone's all about how you bring it, anyway. It seems as if BioWare is keeping to the plan, for the largest part, so I'm happy. Hopefully, Avellone got the chance to give them some suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverandbacon Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 You know you love the echoes! They pwn j00! Chris Avellone's use of "echoes" echoes KOTOR II's writing. Uh oh, we've got a case of echoing echoes. OT: Wait, wasn't this already known? Or was it just that everyone expected it, but no one knew for sure before now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blix Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 There were dark side practitioners long before the Sith. To my knowledge, the Rakata are chronologically the first known darksiders to date. And yeah, everyone here seems to have seen the Great Hyperspace War connection coming from miles away. That's my point: they let us down by taking the most obvious road; the one we all expected. A little more imagination would have gone a long way. You certainly could have had "truer" Sith than those from the Great Hyperspace War because they were not pure-blooded Sith but intermingled with the blood and practices of the Dark Jedi. My idea (I hate to boast but it's the only example I can come up with) would have presented a completely pure line of Sith entirely untouched and completely foreign to their later Dark Jedi conquerers. That way, their quest for revenge could have been directed at the Sith "infadels" (the Sith Order, as it bastardized the Sith culture by being assimilated by the Dark Jedi) instead of wanting to kill the Jedi and the Republic like always. It would have been something new and fresh. Sorry, I tend to ramble. You're right, I seemed to have forgotten our myopic friends from Lehon. I like your idea as well it would be very interesting being able to scour the galaxy for Sith (wannabes) purging them from the records of time, sparing only the true Sith species. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamqd Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Good Idea, but IMO the Dark Jedi are what bought the muscle to the melding of the societies, I'm not sure a few red skinned force mystics would have had the jacobs to pull off a Sidious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.