North Korea Warns of Nuclear War

[jawathehutt]

Saber-rattling aside, I think we have to take seriously the threat that NK would send a nuke flying at Seoul if they decide to get their shorts in knots.

N Korea had better get on with it then if they hope to have any chance, S Korea is supposed to have their missile shield finished by 2012, probably even sooner now that Kim is acting even more insane than usual.

[Q]

I shudder at that thought Jae...and I shudder at what the U.S. response would no doubt be...ICBM's, nuclear tipped Tomahawks...it would be a real life Fallout scenario.

For NK it would, yes. AFAIK, NK has no suitable intercontinental delivery system for their nukes, and it has no thermonukes. The contest would be rather one-sided.

[urluckyday]

^While it's a good thing that they haven't advanced to that point yet...the other fear is that they have will (or may already) have the ability to attack S. Korea (a major major major ally to the US) and in this case...the US has a moral and political responsibility to retaliate...

[Web Rider]

Indeed, even if the entire Korean Peninsula became a nuclear wasteland, the entire would would not become a Fallout-style scenario. There have been thousands of nuclear tests, at least half of them above ground, the nuclear attacks on the Korean Peninsula while they would be far more concentrated and far more devastating to people, would still amount to less than those previous tests.

 

Not to mention that if NK made the first attack, and a nuclear one on that, it would pretty much be The Entire World vs N Korea. Which would be a very short, very one-sided fight.

[EnderWiggin]

All the US would have to do is declare a trade embargo on Chinese items, and their economy would tank.

 

No way would we ever have the economic stability to do that.

 

The Chinese can do whatever they want; an embargo would be like cutting off our own feet.

 

 

_EW_

[Lord of Hunger]

First of all, I do not think that North Korea firing a nuke would start WWIII. Most nations prefer to avoid the end of all civilization and the most that would happen would be that North Korea gets hit but nuclear and cruise missiles to the point where there is nothing left at all. The environment is the area will be ****ed up for awhile, but general consensus is that any nation that tries to nuke another will be blown into so much radioactive ashes rather than allied with.

 

I'm not sure how much of a puppet North Korea is to China anymore, but if China actually starts putting pressure on them I have a feeling that Jong Il (or whoever is running the show at this point) will back down. North Korea saying **** you to China is like a 1 month old baby saying **** you to his/her mother who is actively breastfeeding him/her (if that's even possible).

 

The worst thing possible that can really happen is that Seoul, Tokyo, or both get nuked and then the US, Russia, and China all say together "Oh no you didn't!" and hit their respective big red buttons of DOOM!!!1!, thus causing so much destruction that it will create a rift in time that some North Korea who has been mutated by the explosions can go back and get rid of Kim Jong Il at a crucial moment that would cause the North Korean government to collapse and be assimilated by either China or South Korea.[/MOVIE]

 

Anyway, just though I'd bring some humor to a grim thread.

 

"Always look on the bright side of life...."

[CommanderQ]

First of all, I do not think that North Korea firing a nuke would start WWIII. Most nations prefer to avoid the end of all civilization and the most that would happen would be that North Korea gets hit but nuclear and cruise missiles to the point where there is nothing left at all. The environment is the area will be ****ed up for awhile, but general consensus is that any nation that tries to nuke another will be blown into so much radioactive ashes rather than allied with.

 

I don't know, nuclear war gets just about everyone involved. WWIII is a severe possiblity, but only if NK ticks off the right people. It's not impossible, as Kim Jong Il is no doubt, a madman.

 

Also, we know that the only way to truly win a nuclear war is not by nukes alone. Sure, they would work, but you have achieved nothing if you've just wiped out an entire civilization {but either way, if NK's people are as brainwashed as they seem, they may fight to the death}. You gain nothing from complete destruction, only ruins and a bad name. At least, that is what it seems.

 

Also, regarding China. Interesting example, China is sort've the 'Big Brother' or 'Motherland' so to say, but China and NK have been at odds. As I said earlier Kim Jong Il is unpredicatable. That and NK's isolation tactics make everyone seem like the enemy to them...we'll see.

[Lord of Hunger]

I contend that almost all nations would prefer to avoid nuclear war at any cost and would destroy any offender to do so. The reason why the Cuban Missile Crisis did not trigger WWIII was because we were unwilling to wipe out our species.

[Web Rider]

No way would we ever have the economic stability to do that.

 

The Chinese can do whatever they want; an embargo would be like cutting off our own feet.

 

_EW_

 

And cutting off their hands. NOBODY, I repeat, nobody buys good from China in quantities even close to comparable to the US, and many of the things they make nobody but the US buys at all. Yeah, it would hurt us, we wouldn't get a lot of cheap goods, but honestly, we don't need most of the junk we buy from China anyway.

[mimartin]

Yeah, it would hurt us, we wouldn't get a lot of cheap goods, but honestly, we don't need most of the junk we buy from China anyway.

Yea, but we need the money they loan us to finance our own preemptive wars.

[Totenkopf]

Yea, but we need the money they loan us to finance our own preemptive wars.

 

As well as the nanny state we're now in the process of building, but don't have the money for as well either.

[Web Rider]

Yea, but we need the money they loan us to finance our own preemptive wars.

 

They don't loan us money they buy our bonds.

[mimartin]

They don't loan us money they buy our bonds.

Sorry for being overly simplistic in my humor.

[JediAthos]

"North Korea threatened Wednesday to wipe the United States off the map as Washington and its allies watched for signs the regime will launch a series of missiles in the coming days."

 

-From the AP via Yahoo News (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/as_koreas_nuclear)

 

As laughable as the concept of North Korea wiping the U.S. off the map is (I think it would more likely be the other way around) do you still think the Koreans are just talking or are they really trying to goad the United States into a war?

[CommanderQ]

Oy...that statement was pretty strong...I'm not sure that the North Koreans know what they are getting into. Our economic situation is pretty bad, but that doesn't mean we're weak.

 

But now, I'm absolutley sure they want war. They've been threatening and threatening, over and over, but this is probably the first statement I've read that actually states that they will wipe the United States off the map. I doubt their ability to delt major damage on the mainland of the US, but Alaska and Hawaii{possibly} are within range. They do pose a threat, even if it's a small one. And it looks like they want war.

 

There is also the possibility that NK just has 'little person' Syndrome, and just wants to talk smack to the biggest person they can find....

[urluckyday]

He's just so "ronery" and he needs a friend...

[Arcesious]

It's perfect for them. If they manage to bait the president into a war, it would be at one of the worst possible times for us in terms of economics.

 

What would be the motivation NK has to make threats like this, besides KJII being crazy? Surely the NK military & government don't want to commit suicide.

 

It seems to me that NK would only be baiting the US into war if they had some sort of trap ready.

[JediAthos]

I think President Obama is smart enough not to attack North Korea without direct provocation. Anything else would draw the ire of the Chinese and the rest of the international community.

 

If war breaks out on the Korean Peninsula it will because Kim Jong Il started it...not the United States.

[CommanderQ]

^^Well....they do have Chinese and Russian allies. And I imagine their economies aren't near half as bad as ours right now. Kim Jong Il is on the way out, that much is obvious, last year's stroke was the first sign, and we still have no word onto how much power Kim Jong has, or if he does have complete power, what is the state of his sanity?

 

This could also be the beginning of a shift in power. Someone may take advantage of Kim Jong Il's situation, and you never know, a coup de tat? This would be the time to do it.

 

Well, Arc, I agree with you that it seems that NK really wants war with the US, and we should be wary of what surprises NK may have in waiting. If war should come, NK could either be slaughtered...or become more powerful. We'll have to wait and see.

 

 

He's just so "ronery" and he needs a friend...

 

Awww...poor wittle Kim doesn't have any fwiends to talk to... I wonder why?

[Astor]

^^Well....they do have Chinese and Russian allies.

 

They may have more cordial relations with North Korea than the West, but Moscow and Beijing weren't too happy about the missile tests a few weeks ago.

 

And I imagine their economies aren't near half as bad as ours right now. Kim Jong Il is on the way out, that much is obvious, last year's stroke was the first sign, and we still have no word onto how much power Kim Jong has, or if he does have complete power, what is the state of his sanity?

 

The man believe's he's irresistable to women. So i'd it's not looking good on the sanity front.

 

War may not be as inevitable as people think - this could all be a lot of posturing. But it's not like the US Government isn't ready to respond, with around 30,000 troops across the border in South Korea.

 

I don't think Pyongyang would be stupid enough to actually launch any kind of attack on anyone, but I guess we won't know what's going to happen for certain until next Saturday.

[mur'phon]

Originally posted by Jae

NK has a lot of troops, and they may be decently trained for all I know, but with the strict sanctions on NK already, I'm not sure how well armed or even how well-fed they are. NK does not have the resources at all to fight a prolonged war. I think if there was a conflict, SK, the US, and the UN would steamroll through the country in a matter of weeks.

 

If by steamroll you mean getting to "misson acomplished" (as defined by your former president) then maybe, but the whole "millions" of soldiers and far better equpment than Iraq/Afghanistan means it'll be a lot of coffin ferries in use. Unless we opt for the nuke aproach.

 

Originally posted by Web

And cutting off their hands. NOBODY, I repeat, nobody buys good from China in quantities even close to comparable to the US, and many of the things they make nobody but the US buys at all. Yeah, it would hurt us, we wouldn't get a lot of cheap goods, but honestly, we don't need most of the junk we buy from China anyway.

 

Err, you do, aside from the bond issue (China stops bying US bonds-> US enters a recession like this one^10). While you might not "need" some of what they export, it'll still cause inflation from hell. Both countries will be in deep ****, but the US will be far deeper.

 

Originally posted by JediA

do you still think the Koreans are just talking or are they really trying to goad the United States into a war?

 

No war, but it might be benefical for them to have a little skirmish, pherhaps sending a few missiles over the border, or sink a couple of ships.

 

originally posted by CQI'

m not sure that the North Koreans know what they are getting into.

 

Since Kim family has been doing stuff like this for decades, I'd say if anyone knows, it's Kim.

 

Well....they do have Chinese and Russian allies.

 

No, they don't, let's take a look at some of the motivations for each of those two countries to be as "nice" to NK.

 

China: Shares a border, if NK collapse China gets milions of uneducated refugees which will be an enormous drain. It's also very much against intervening in what it considers soverreign countries as it fears that would leav it open to such interventions. It's also starting to flex its muscles as Asia's superpower, so American intervention is even worse for it than intervention in other places. Finaly, with SK being such a close US ally reunification will leave China with a semi-rival at its doorstep.

 

 

Russia: Russia is motivated primarly by A: the same dislike of (at least other countries) intervening in states, and to a much lesser extent B: the fact that showing America the middle finger is wonderfull domestic policy.

 

Neither is anywere close to an alliance.

 

And I imagine their economies aren't near half as bad as ours right now.

 

Half right, China do a lot better than the US, Russia a lot worse.

 

or if he does have complete power, what is the state of his sanity?

 

Sane, yes, predictable, no.

 

This could also be the beginning of a shift in power. Someone may take advantage of Kim Jong Il's situation, and you never know, a coup de tat? This would be the time to do it.

 

Not sure if that'd be a good thing, but who knows.

 

If war should come, NK could either be slaughtered...or become more powerful. We'll have to wait and see.

 

Hedge, hedge, hedge, though I'd love to hear how NK could become more powerfull after a war (a skirmish is does not a war make).

 

Originally posted by Astor

The man believe's he's irresistable to women. So i'd it's not looking good on the sanity front.

 

When said women have been brainwashed into believing he is the Messiah.....

Not exactly insane.