Unpopular opinions

[Lagomorph01]

I don’t like Star Wars either. Part 4, 5 and 6 are films from my youth, so I’ll gladly watch those with my kid when he gets old enough, and I can honestly say that I think Empire is a good movie. But everything that has been done with it since (to me) was just crap.

 

I never liked the prequels, but I can honestly say that I prefer them to the horrendous sequels that Disney produced. At least George Lucas had a vision of where he wanted to take his franchise. Disney is just milking the cow dry, and the way they handled the sequels to such a beloved franchise is just outrageous! (Especially when you consider they literally promised George Lucas they’d produce his sequels when he sold them said cow, which they never did.)

 

So in closure, even though I like 4, 5 and 6, and can even say one of them is a good movie, I can now say I like only a very small part of what Star Wars is, and that part is only getting smaller as more VOD crap is being produced.

 

3 hours ago, Marius said:

(Pssst, please put ReMI content outside the ReMI thread into spoiler tags, k thx byeee)

Thanks for this! 

 

[BaronGrackle]

1 hour ago, Lagomorph01 said:

I don’t like Star Wars either. Part 4, 5 and 6 are films from my youth, so I’ll gladly watch those with my kid when he gets old enough, and I can honestly say that I think Empire is a good movie. But everything that has been done with it since (to me) was just crap.

 

You are not a Lucasarts Star Wars gamer from the 90s-00s? No Kyle Katarn, X-Wing and TIE Fighter, and/or Knights of the Old Republic?

 

KOTOR has some moments that feel pretty adventure gamey. And I'll always cherish the moments I rampaged through Barons Hed with Max the lagomorph.

[Lagomorph01]

6 minutes ago, BaronGrackle said:

You are not a Lucasarts Star Wars gamer from the 90s-00s? No Kyle Katarn, X-Wing and TIE Fighter, and/or Knights of the Old Republic?

 

KOTOR has some moments that feel pretty adventure gamey. And I'll always cherish the moments I rampaged through Barons Hed with Max the lagomorph.

No, I never cared much for the 90's Star Wars games. I did play the Dark Forces demo a couple of times though. That was pretty fun. I do like the fact that they steered away from the Skywalker family, something Disney still hasn't really dared to do.

[BaronGrackle]

5 minutes ago, Lagomorph01 said:

No, I never cared much for the 90's Star Wars games. I did play the Dark Forces demo a couple of times though. That was pretty fun. I do like the fact that they steered away from the Skywalker family, something Disney still hasn't really dared to do.

If you ever decide to give KOTOR a chance (now on Switch), try as a Scoundrel named Guybrush, and play like him.

 

Then it's The Largo Embargo, The Three Trials, Four Map Pieces, and Guybrush Kicks Butt.

[ThunderPeel2001]

11 hours ago, Staple Remover said:

After a recent playthrough, I have developed the wildly unpopular opinion that If they included the spitting contest and the bone song, the Monkey Island 2 lite version would be a better than the regular. 

 

Strangely, you're not the first person I've heard to say that. I think Ron made a big mistake making an "easy" and "hard" mode. (Same with Thimbleweed Park.) Curse's "Normal" and "Hard" was perfect.

[Staple Remover]

4 hours ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

 

Strangely, you're not the first person I've heard to say that. I think Ron made a big mistake making an "easy" and "hard" mode. (Same with Thimbleweed Park.) Curse's "Normal" and "Hard" was perfect.

I wasn’t a fan of it in Thimbleweed Park, but I did love the Ransom uncensored DLC for being a new “version” of the game. 

[Wally B.]

I have some unpopular opinions regarding Tales.

I don't really get what all the fuss is about and why people like it so much over Escape:

I don't like the Morgan-Guybrush-Elaine-Lechuck "love conflict" they have going on.

It has the art style I like less in all of the games (not including special editions), even though I still like it.

The puzzles are really easy, even though they are interesting in concept.

It's overly dramatic for a Monkey Island game.

It has unfortunately the worst music because of the limitations of the WiiWare.

I didn't mind the same character models reused for other characters, I think it's really cool how they made each pirate on Flotsam feel really different and unique with that limitation.

 

I have some other gripes with it and decided to end with a positive unpopular opinion because with all that said, I still really like the game and what it was trying to achieve, and I really have fun playing it.

 

20 hours ago, Staple Remover said:

I did love the Ransom uncensored DLC for being a new “version” of the game. 

On another note, I thought the Ransom DLC was pointless and kind of ruined the whole joke with the character. I think the bleeps over curse words are way funnier than the curse words themselves

 

[KestrelPi]

12 minutes ago, Wally B. said:

I have some unpopular opinions regarding Tales.

I don't really get what all the fuss is about and why people like it so much over Escape:

I don't like the Morgan-Guybrush-Elaine-Lechuck "love conflict" they have going on.

It has the art style I like less in all of the games (not including special editions), even though I still like it.

The puzzles are really easy, even though they are interesting in concept.

It's overly dramatic for a Monkey Island game.

It has unfortunately the worst music because of the limitations of the WiiWare.

I didn't mind the same character models reused for other characters, I think it's really cool how they made each pirate on Flotsam feel really different and unique with that limitation.

 

I have some other gripes with it and decided to end with a positive unpopular opinion because with all that said, I still really like the game and what it was trying to achieve, and I really have fun playing it.

 

 

On another note, I thought the Ransom DLC was pointless and kind of ruined the whole joke with the character. I think the bleeps over curse words are way funnier than the curse words themselves

 

 

I consider Tales a good 'first try' for the team and I wish they'd got more tries, in a way just like they did with Sam and Max and got better and better at it. They were clearly limited by hardware, and it took quite a while for the series to hit its stride, but I liked a lot of it and what it was gesturing at.

 

I think a lot of people are kind to it because it feels like it's heart is mostly in the right place, and seems to be trying to get back to some of the the more mysterious aspects of the earlier games, even if it doesn't always completely succeed with it. It was a game that... to me felt like it was interested in understanding what makes a Monkey Island game tick and finding new ways to express that, which I personally found more enjoyable than EMI's 'turn it all up to 11' approach.

 

I do think the puzzles are better than I remembered, when I played it earlier this year. They're not terribly difficult, but I did get stuck sometimes, and honestly I'm not sure I'd especially want a much harder time than that. I've always liked my adventure game puzzles to provide some enjoyable resistance, not to stop me dead. I don't mind being a bit stuck, but I never enjoyed grinding to a halt.

[Wally B.]

15 minutes ago, KestrelPi said:

I think a lot of people are kind to it because it feels like it's heart is mostly in the right place, and seems to be trying to get back to some of the the more mysterious aspects of the earlier games, even if it doesn't always completely succeed with it.

I can totally get behind this, it's actually how I feel about the game and why I like it.

 

But my point is (and it's another unpopular opinion, i guess) is that Escape is a game that knows what it wants to be (even though it may not be of everyone's liking) and so, to me, it feels more coherent and a better experience than Tales. Tales might feel more familiar though, and that's why people like it over Escape.

 

Also I think Escape (when you get in the right mindset) is kinda easy. Certainly easier than Monkey 2 at least. And the pc controls are good and easy to grasp.

[BaronGrackle]

When I look at reddit polls (a true and reliable metric, I know), Escape polls better than Tales when all of the Monkey Island games are choices. Tales polls better than Escape when they are the only two choices.

 

You can infer different things from that, but to me it suggests that Escape has a very distinct feel to it that can translate as love-it-or-hate-it.

Edited August 3, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[BaronGrackle]

The re-use of character models in Tales of Monkey Island was not a system constraint but a deliberate homage to the replicated animatronics in Disney's Pirates of the Caribbean rides: https://earzup-podcast.com/2021/03/the-many-faces-of-disneylands-pirates-of-the-caribbean-part-1/

 

This opinion is unpopular because it is objectively wrong. But maybe you can start circulating it anyway.

[BillyCheers]

I don't think this is exactly an unpopular opinion because most people probably just don't care, but....

 

I always thought the naming of MI2 is stupid! Not the "LeChuck's Revenge" part, but the order of the two elements: The logo on the boxart and in the game clearly says "LeChuck's Revenge: Monkey Island (2)", but everywhere else it always says "Monkey Island 2 - LeChuck's Revenge".  And I have no idea why!
A small detail one may say... But 1. it's inconsistent and 2. it seems more like a cheap sequel to me, when the "Monkey Island 2" is put first. I mean, we're talking about the best sequel of all times here (go home, "Last Crusade" and "Empire"!).

[LowLevel]

On 6/8/2022 at 12:54 AM, BillyCheers said:

I thought it could be fun to share some unpopular opinions on Monkey Island (or maybe LucasArts games in general)

 

OK. You wanted it.

 

I hate "Maniac Mansion" and "Zak McKracken and the Alien Mindbenders" with a passion and I think that they are badly designed games, especially the first one.

 

I assume that they were the inevitable result of an experimental phase when, at LucasFilm Games, basic/good guidelines for adventure game design were not fully formed or shared among authors.

 

My love for The Secret of Monkey Island can exist only because, a bit later, Ron Gilbert developed a few design rules, which he also shared publicly in his somewhat famous article "Why Adventure Games Suck".

 

I wholeheartedly agree with Ron when he wrote:

 

Quote

In Maniac Mansion, in one place or another, I violated all but one of these rules. Some of them were violated by design, others by sloppiness. If I could redesign Maniac Mansion, all the violations would be removed and I'd have a much better game. [Source]

 

_{(I will deny any evidence that I wrote this post. Any attempt to impose reality on me will be met with violent counterattacks of confusing fantasies.)}

[KestrelPi]

15 minutes ago, LowLevel said:

 

OK. You wanted it.

 

I hate "Maniac Mansion" and "Zak McKracken and the Alien Mindbenders" with a passion and I think that they are badly designed games, especially the first one.

 

I assume that they were the inevitable result of an experimental phase when, at LucasFilm Games, basic/good guidelines for adventure game design were not fully formed or shared among authors.

 

My love for The Secret of Monkey Island can exist only because, a bit later, Ron Gilbert developed a few design rules, which he also shared publicly in his somewhat famous article "Why Adventure Games Suck".

 

I wholeheartedly agree with Ron when he wrote:

 

 

_{(I will deny any evidence that I wrote this post. Any attempt to impose reality on me will be met with violent counterattacks of confusing fantasies.)}

 

I wonder how unpopular this opinion actually is.

 

I have sort of 'messed' with Maniac Mansion via DOTT, but I've never played it with a serious intention of seeing it through to completion. If I did, I'd use a walkthrough, because I have no intention of playing an adventure game which doesn't basically follow the design rules Ron developed ahead of Monkey Island. Whenever I've tried, I've not had a good time. Even if the game is not hard, if I'm worried that I'm going to be fighting the game's design constantly to make progress, and it might even become unwinnable, I'm not going to be able to relax and play them.

 

I love adventure games, but it would be more accurate to say that I love post 1990 LucasArts adventure games. Everything else? Very hit and miss, for me.

[Vainamoinen]

On 8/2/2022 at 11:07 AM, BaronGrackle said:

You are not a Lucasarts Star Wars gamer from the 90s-00s? No Kyle Katarn, X-Wing and TIE Fighter, and/or Knights of the Old Republic?

 

No, no, no, and FUCK YEEEEEEEESSSS

 

On 8/2/2022 at 11:07 AM, BaronGrackle said:

KOTOR has some moments that feel pretty adventure gamey.

 

These adventure gamey moments in RPGs always feel so half assed. It's really not the same kind of exploration or combination. I wish the genres would actually seamlessly merge, that really has potential. Point and click adventure RPGs. I'd buy those! But I'd rather make those myself.

[ThunderPeel2001]

2 hours ago, LowLevel said:

 

OK. You wanted it.

 

I hate "Maniac Mansion" and "Zak McKracken and the Alien Mindbenders" with a passion and I think that they are badly designed games, especially the first one.

 

I assume that they were the inevitable result of an experimental phase when, at LucasFilm Games, basic/good guidelines for adventure game design were not fully formed or shared among authors.

 

My love for The Secret of Monkey Island can exist only because, a bit later, Ron Gilbert developed a few design rules, which he also shared publicly in his somewhat famous article "Why Adventure Games Suck".

 

I wholeheartedly agree with Ron when he wrote:

 

 

_{(I will deny any evidence that I wrote this post. Any attempt to impose reality on me will be met with violent counterattacks of confusing fantasies.)}

 

This is why Maniac Mansion Deluxe (the fan made game) is basically the best version of MM... it blocks all the dead ends.

 

However, even the original MM and Zak are oozing with charm. But they are, indeed, a product of their unforgiving day. (Just don't try any Infocom titles if you don't like these early LucasArts efforts!)

 

Edited August 18, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

1 hour ago, Vainamoinen said:

These adventure gamey moments in RPGs always feel so half assed. It's really not the same kind of exploration or combination.

True, but the dialogue puzzles succeed in getting me!

 

Great moments in dialogue puzzles

Last Crusade: Every interaction with Nazi guards.

 

Secret of Monkey Island: Defeating the Swordmaster, buying the Sea Monkey.

 

Fate of Atlantis: Final dialogue with Dr. Uberman. (Honorable mention: resisting the urge to sell fine leather jackets to an armed, trigger-happy guard.)

 

Knights of the Old Republic I and II: Too many to count. Top prize goes to your trial in Manaan if you destroy their kolto supply and ruin them.

Edited August 18, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[KestrelPi]

20 minutes ago, BaronGrackle said:

True, but the dialogue puzzles succeed in getting me!

 

Great moments in dialogue puzzles

Last Crusade: Every interaction with Nazi guards.

 

Secret of Monkey Island: Defeating the Swordmaster, buying the Sea Monkey.

 

Fate of Atlantis: Final dialogue with Dr. Uberman. (Honorable mention: resisting the urge to sell fine leather jackets to an armed, trigger-happy guard.)

 

Knights of the Old Republic I and II: Too many to count. Top prize goes to your trial in Manaan if you destroy their kolto supply and ruin them.

Don't forget:

 

Full Throttle: getting Maureen aaaand this is dubious but I'd argue that the final puzzle in Full Throttle is basically just a dialog puzzle with a fancy interface. At least, it has the same sort of structure

 

 

 

 

[BaronGrackle]

53 minutes ago, KestrelPi said:

Don't forget:

 

Full Throttle: getting Maureen aaaand this is dubious but I'd argue that the final puzzle in Full Throttle is basically just a dialog puzzle with a fancy interface. At least, it has the same sort of structure

 

 

 

 

Yes, convincing Maureen to stop tearing you apart! Fair point on the vehicle computer inputs.

 

Monkey 2: Winning Elaine over. I thought the answers were obvious, but apparently some playtesters had to work at it. It looks like she has a little system of "getting warmer" and "getting colder" reflected in her responses to you, similar to how MI1 Stan will always give you his current appraisal of the ship's worth if you ask him.

 

Curse: I don't care if I did it in MI1 already: defeating Rottingham.

 

Tales: Romancing the manatee, the melee a trois with Morgan and the swordfighter

 

Was there a great dialogue-based puzzle in Grim Fandango? Little things like convincing Glottis to be your driver come to mind, but I don't recall a moment of major dialogue challenge.

It's funny because, in the poetry bar in Year 2, my children initially thought you needed the correct poem to win over the marxist beatniks at the table. Maybe it's because when you ask about your poem, the three of them give different critiques... my kids didn't realize the critiques were always the same, and a red herring.

Edited August 18, 2022 by BaronGrackle
"No beads, you crazy old man!"

[Thrik]

1 hour ago, BaronGrackle said:

Was there a great dialogue-based puzzle in Grim Fandango? Little things like convincing Glottis to be your driver come to mind, but I don't recall a moment of major dialogue challenge.

It's funny because, in the poetry bar in Year 2, my children initially thought you needed the correct poem to win over the marxist beatniks at the table. Maybe it's because when you ask about your poem, the three of them give different critiques... my kids didn't realize the critiques were always the same, and a red herring.

I wouldn’t call it great but I think trying to escape the garage via Salvador would qualify as one. Also setting the correct answer machine message is indirectly a dialogue puzzle.

[KestrelPi]

9 minutes ago, Thrik said:

I wouldn’t call it great but I think trying to escape the garage via Salvador would qualify as one. Also setting the correct answer machine message is indirectly a dialogue puzzle.

Another one I suppose from GF would be trying to persuade Celso and his wife to buy a number 9 ticket. Pretty minor puzzle, though

 

 

[BaronGrackle]

Minor perhaps, but both of those are good examples. Now I remember reading someone's opinion, that selling Celso the ticket is the best glimpse we have of Manny the travel agent.

[BaronGrackle]

@ThunderPeel2001, I just had the pleasure of reading your Last Crusade walkthrough on gamefaqs that you wrote 20 years ago or so! Reading about the punch, retreat, punch strategy again takes me back.

 

And I share your opinion, which may be unpopular: the fighting system in Last Crusade was far superior to the one in Fate of Atlantis. (Though the sucker punch was nice.)

Edited August 19, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

50 minutes ago, BaronGrackle said:

@ThunderPeel2001, I just had the pleasure of reading your Last Crusade walkthrough on gamefaqs that you wrote 20 years ago or so! Reading about the punch, retreat, punch strategy again takes me back.

 

And I share your opinion, which may be unpopular: the fighting system in Last Crusade was far superior to the one in Fate of Atlantis. (Though the sucker punch was nice.)

 

Ah, thank you! It's sort of frozen in time in all its terribly broken CSS glory. I keep meaning to update it properly -- redesign the whole damn thing and add a few bits of missing information, but I'm glad you enjoyed it! I still say it's a very under-appreciated game... but you do need a guide to get through the dialogue "puzzles" because they're so unforgiving and random.

 

EDIT: Oh wow. Just noticed you said you read the GameFAQs version. The best version is probably this one:

https://indyguide.mixnmojo.com/

Edited August 19, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

I remember in AOL forum days, I had Castle Brunwald down. I was much flakier on the Airport and exit from Germany, but that Castle Brunwald I just enjoyed playing through in various ways.

 

If I wanted to avoid switching uniforms often, I'd just knock out Corporal Kruger (#3), and I'd avoid touching the ale guard (#1, who you can also pass by offering a drink) until I had the officer's uniform. He lets an officer pass automatically without any dialogue puzzle, and then I'd never have to switch clothes... though maybe that doesn't net I.Q. points, I forget.

 

And I recall that, to "clear a path" as your guide described, I needed to fight some guards in a certain order... and I think I even talked to most of them first so that the tough ones didn't chase me down early.
 

Textbook alarm guard (#8) was a Medium (or maybe he was Hard, but the area was large enough I could retreat a huge amount?); I needed to give Mein Kampf to save my energy - and I recall he would start attacking if I'd already knocked out some guards before meeting him. Also his hair color changed if you went to the save menu after punching him out. Painting guard (#4) was also a Medium, but the painting made him disappear so that was nice. The Easy guards were the ones on the first floor (#2, #3) and the nervous guard at the top of the third floor stairs (#9). I'd target them first, and manage to keep full health. Then the Medium hallway guards were the heavyset one at the end of the 2nd floor (#7) and the officer Sigfried (#11), so I'd fight one then use first aid before facing the other.

 

It was a shame that, after planning all that or faking Colonel Vogel with the old book, it still teleported you to the middle of Germany afterward.

 

I wish some of Secret of Monkey Island's contemporaries had gotten modern rerelease treatment. Add a sucker punch option, and Last Crusade is good to go!