MdKnightR Posted July 20, 2005 Share Posted July 20, 2005 to lukeiamyourdad: I never said it sucked either. I just said that I don't care for it. And, of course no one complains about a real person playing numerous roles in the movies. What are we going to do, change our faces? I know that Anime is more about the storyline than the art, but that is one of the points where I take exception to the genre. I think that if you want to tell a story and not care about visual art, write a book or make an audio recording. That is what I like about Bill Sienkiewicz. When he was working on The New Mutants for Marvel Comics back in the 80s, it was more about the art than the storyline. Well, that's not entirely true, the story was told through the pictures. Frank Miller did that a lot as well. Check out Bill's links in my previous post. to Aash Li: No offense was taken, I just wanted to make myself clear. I have seen lots of anime. On occasion, I have watched Cowboy Bebop on Adult Swim when nothing else was on. I know that there is a difference between adult anime and kids stuff like Dragonball Z, but the main difference is in the content, not the art. I just don't care for the visuals of the characters because the style hasn't evolved. Just 2 more cents. At this rate, I'll be rich by the time the Argo takes off for Iscandar! MdK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevanA4 Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 @ AAsh Li on the dbz topic lets agree to disagree and not bring it up:) @Those of you who are thinking about checking anime` out you should not get discouraged because you are lost because most anime is in a series and each episode builds on the last and once you've seen a few episodes you will begin to understand the story more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aash Li Posted July 21, 2005 Author Share Posted July 21, 2005 A warning though, there are SOME anime that no matter how many episodes you watch, or how many times you have watched an episode, or even how closely you paid attention, they STILL wont make any sense. Paranoia Agent being the one that I think of most readily. Well ok Jedigoku, even though its cute to watch you get flustered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyborgninja Posted July 21, 2005 Share Posted July 21, 2005 sometimes u think that an anime is kiddish but most people fail to relize the deeper plot of the matter like fooly cooly people think it is just a bunch of random crap but in actuality it is about growing up if u get past all the chaos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by Cyborgninja sometimes u think that an anime is kiddish but most people fail to relize the deeper plot of the matter like fooly cooly people think it is just a bunch of random crap but in actuality it is about growing up if u get past all the chaos And sometimes an anime is just random crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDJOHNNYMIKE Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Ok, ya'll inspired me:p right after work, I sat down to watch some telly and cool off, I was watching one of those Sinbad movies (never really saw much of them either, huh) And at the bottom of the screen it said that there was one of those Anime movies coming on, I figured, well I might as well watch it while I'm sitting in a shady basement:D It was called Black Magic 66 or something like that, the title kind of made me think twice, but I figured I'd give it a shot, it was kind of interesting, but there was a lot of stuff that didn't make sense, like military robots having opportunities to kill their targets, and just doing something stupid instead, Has anybody seen that one, and can they tell me if it's a quality example of the genre, if that's supposed to be a good one, then maybe I won't watch anymore, cuz it was pretty corny:p I'm guessing it wasn't one of the kiddish ones becaue the main character was buck naked in the opening scene:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by MdKnightR to lukeiamyourdad: I never said it sucked either. I just said that I don't care for it. And, of course no one complains about a real person playing numerous roles in the movies. What are we going to do, change our faces? It's like re-using a winning formula. You know Samuel L. Jackson is a star and he's going to help sell your movie. That's why people hire him back. That's why people who like anime don't mind the similarities. It's a winning formula, it's not broken, let's re-use it. Originally posted by MdKnightR I know that Anime is more about the storyline than the art, but that is one of the points where I take exception to the genre. I think that if you want to tell a story and not care about visual art, write a book or make an audio recording. Then why have TV shows? Why have music videos when it's all about the song? Why have movies based on books? Simple, people want to see it with their eyes. They want to see the action unfolding in front of their eyes. You have to know that this is something done on the other side of the planet. Their way of thinking is very different then ours. If you've ever watched some live-action japanese or korean shows, you'll actually see things that are supposed to be in anime. What we consider as cartoons is the equivalent of live-action shows for them. Which is why the focus is entirely on story-telling. It's live action. It's like a Star Trek serie. It's any TV serie. Just without actors and using animation. Also, it has no borders. Western animation is plagued by this "kid friendly" mindset. It means that a cartoon has to be either kid friendly or a comedy. The only western cartoon that dared go past that border (in my knowledge, I'd be very happy if you could tell me about others who did the same) is the Spawn animated serie. Anime has been doing psycho-analysis of their characters for over twenty-years. They've explored mature subjects for that long. Anime is getting more popular because of that simple fact. It feels more mature. It simply doesn't feel kiddy. There is a style in which anime is done. You'll notice that there's a lot of images that are nothing more then a painting of a setting, creating a certain nostalgia. There's a lot of cases of a scene consisting of nothing more then a bucket of water with water dripping into it. Originally posted by MdKnightR That is what I like about Bill Sienkiewicz. When he was working on The New Mutants for Marvel Comics back in the 80s, it was more about the art than the storyline. Well, that's not entirely true, the story was told through the pictures. Frank Miller did that a lot as well. Check out Bill's links in my previous post. Those are comic books and we're talking about animation. However, I fully agree with you that western comic book artists surpass the japanese and by far. Not only artistically, but also in terms of story-telling and plot development. They're at least equally good. Again, it's mainly because western comic books haven't been plagued by this wish to make it kid friendly. I've read a bunch of comic books and frankly, they're not kid friendly anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by REDJOHNNYMIKE It was called Black Magic 66 or something like that, the title kind of made me think twice, but I figured I'd give it a shot, it was kind of interesting, but there was a lot of stuff that didn't make sense, like military robots having opportunities to kill their targets, and just doing something stupid instead, Has anybody seen that one, and can they tell me if it's a quality example of the genre, if that's supposed to be a good one, then maybe I won't watch anymore, cuz it was pretty corny:p Most probably a bad one. Never heard of it. I'd suggest watching well known series first. Cowboy Bebop is an excellent serie to start with. Not kiddie at all since there's quite a bit of blood and well, Faye Valentine Ghost in The Shell is a good movie to start with but I would go for one of the Hayao Miyazaki directed movies. They might seem more kiddie but they certainly have a good charm. Try to rent Princess Momonoke or Spirited Away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyborgninja Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by Prime And sometimes an anime is just random crap. yes there is also random crap anime to but not fooly cooly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevanA4 Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by Aash Li Well ok Jedigoku, even though its cute to watch you get flustered. *Looks around the room* ok where are the cameras:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aash Li Posted July 22, 2005 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 LIAYD, I couldnt have said that better myself (and I tried too!). lol I think Japanese do better at animation, simply because of what was said, they dont have to make it kid-friendly. But their manga isnt that bad either. They dont tend to do the whole manga in colour like the majority of western comics, which is sad, because Ive always loved western comics because of that (Im an artist, I love colour). Their story telling I think they are trying to do still image anime - hence all the dynamic actions shots and whatnot in the manga, instead of trying to convey the storyline. But not all manga suffers from kid-friendliness, theres bunches of them that are jsut as "bad" as some of their anime, when it comes to certain things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDJOHNNYMIKE Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Like I said, I only watched it because it was on at the time, the stuff everybody recommended, Aash Li said was on at saturday night, and now isn't then:D And renting around here, requires you to donate organs, and give up rights to first, second, and third born children:D I'll catch them whenever I can though:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MdKnightR Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by lukeiamyourdad However, I fully agree with you that western comic book artists surpass the japanese and by far. Not only artistically, but also in terms of story-telling and plot development. They're at least equally good. Again, it's mainly because western comic books haven't been plagued by this wish to make it kid friendly. I've read a bunch of comic books and frankly, they're not kid friendly anymore. Thank you for observing this! Not only that, but thanks for admitting it. Comics haven't been "kid friendly" for years. Even back when I was a kid, there were some themes that I am amazed made it past the Comics Code Authority in those days. Comics have been tackling tough issues for a very long time. Originally posted by lukeiamyourdad Those are comic books and we're talking about animation. Comic books or animation and their differences are not the issue that I brought up. I am talking about the style of drawing, not whether the pictures move. Let me tell you, not only from the standpoint of an artist, but also from being an art teacher, that Anime is sometimes what keeps kids out of art colleges. I am not exaggerating here. Many a college rep. has come to my class over the years and the resounding advice that they have for high school students serious about pursuing an art career is "don't put Anime in your portfolio." The reason? The same thing that I have said from the beginning...lack of originality. Now, before someone blows up and starts a new rant, let me clarify something. It is not that they see Anime as non-art...quite the contrary. But what the professors and admission counselors know is that the people who have been doing Anime professionally had to know how to draw traditionally in the first place. The caricatures that now have become a formula were originally drawn by artists that were familiar with human anatomy and movement. Only after having gained that knowledge can someone effectively exaggerate. I tell my kids to "learn the rules, then learn how to break them" all the time when it comes to such things. It is quite irritating when I get students who know how to whip out an Anime caricature in a few minutes but can't pick up a pencil and draw a vase sitting on the table in front of them. Or can't describe the correct proportions of the human face or body. Not only that (because that alone would be fairly easy to correct), many of them don't have a desire to truly learn how to draw! They are content in themselves to just doodle around and fantasize of cartooning for Disney instead of working toward those dreams! And, let me tell ya, if you can't draw that vase on the table, you can't work for Disney's animation department. Many years ago, when Disney was working on The Hunchback of Notre Dame, they flew their artists to Paris so that they could spend weeks drawing the cathedral in every angle and detail. That takes skill! Skill that many of my Anime fans will never attain because they are stuck in their perceptions. Anyway, that is about enough for my soapbox for now. I am sure I will have ample opportunity to get back on it tomorrow. MdK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derc Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Not to interrupted the discussion or anything... but the anime I like: Current favorite: Gundam SEED Destiny. Heck, that's where my avatar comes from. Other anime I like: Gundam SEED Trigun Cowboy Bebop (even got the movie) Detective Conan ( I wish they bring it back to Adult Swin soon ) ...and really that's all I've liked, out of the few anime series that I've actually watched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChAiNz.2da Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by MdKnightR I tell my kids to "learn the rules, then learn how to break them" all the time when it comes to such things. It is quite irritating when I get students who know how to whip out an Anime caricature in a few minutes but can't pick up a pencil and draw a vase sitting on the table in front of them. My Art teacher did the exact same thing and it was probably the best advice I was ever given when it came to Art. Be it my sketches, cells, or animation. I'm glad to see she wasn't "unique"... That's fantastic advice MdKnightR Just thought you should know from a student that's heard that before. To the students you have that listens, they'll either appreciate the advice, or will in the future (even if they don't tell you )... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aash Li Posted July 22, 2005 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 My cousin is like that. He can draw anime fairly well, but cant draw other types of art worth crap. I on the other hand have a hell of a time drawing a figure that looks anime, let alone asian. lol. Ashley's Art And theres my art gallery to prove it! hehe. I took two years of art at the community college as well, and in school I took as many art classes as I could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 @MdKnightR- So you're an art teacher eh? *puts his K98 at MdKnightR's feet as a sign of defeat* Well, since you're an art teacher, it is more then natural that for you, that would be the most important aspect of anime. To me, it isn't, but it's a question of preferences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MdKnightR Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by ChAiNz.2da My Art teacher did the exact same thing and it was probably the best advice I was ever given when it came to Art. Be it my sketches, cells, or animation. I'm glad to see she wasn't "unique"... That's fantastic advice MdKnightR Just thought you should know from a student that's heard that before. To the students you have that listens, they'll either appreciate the advice, or will in the future (even if they don't tell you )... Thanks so much for that bit of encouragement. I am glad to hear that I am not the only one who gives that kind of advice as well! To Aash Li - Is there any more drawings that you have posted other than those 2? I am interested in seeing more. To lukeiamyourdad - No need to be so dramatic. I just wanted people to know where I'm coming from. MdK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aash Li Posted July 22, 2005 Author Share Posted July 22, 2005 Click on the gallery link, theres loads there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted July 22, 2005 Share Posted July 22, 2005 Originally posted by MdKnightR To lukeiamyourdad - No need to be so dramatic. I just wanted people to know where I'm coming from. I was just kidding around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StoneDragon Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 I do like anime, but I don't know specificaly what I like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevanA4 Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 Originally posted by StoneDragon I do like anime, but I don't know specificaly what I like. err that sounds impossible you like it but don't know what you like:confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Devon Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 ^^^ It's not impossible. He might like the style of drawing anime uses, but not some (rather stupid) show like Pokemon or Dragon Ball Z. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RevanA4 Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 errrrrr ya make fun of DBZ again and I'll.... :hit4: :hit4: :hit4: :hit4: note you have been warned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MdKnightR Posted July 23, 2005 Share Posted July 23, 2005 Just poking at DBZ (is it real Anime?) Seriously though, even my students who are hardcore about their Anime equate DBZ with Powerpuff Girls. MdK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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