[SPOILER] Revan's gender.

[Gargoyle King]

Wow! You guys sure have a lot to say about the subject!

Revan is still Revan, and always will be Revan - Does it really matter to anyone what the gender of Revan is? (although i thought being a Female Revan was way cooler).

[Rockstar]

The game shows completely that either gender could be canon, and later Star Wars states that Palpatine altered the archives of the galaxy to his liking, so it's hard to be sure something like gender could not have been changed in the long run.

 

I am usually a respecting person of people's opinions but... that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard!

 

PALPATINE: *changing Revan's gender in the archives* "Muhahaha the Republic wont know what hit them! Muhahaha. With Revan now a women, I will rule the galaxy!!! Muhahahaha!!

 

Why!? There is nothing to gain, Revan would be long dead. Just suck it in and face the facts! The only reason you have the other choices is because RPG's are now more open ended in terms of game play and open endedness. Revan WAS a male lightside human Jedi.... actually... maybe he was a Twi'lek?

 

All the game makers meant was "This is what it's supposed to be, but the way you play your game is up to you."

 

 

 

In regards to her romance, Bastilla's connection and dialogue with you, i felt was good. When the romance goes on hold till you face Malek in your first confrontation, she was simply unable to talk about it further as she was seriously considering betraying her every belief for love. The ONLY vice of the romance (which i thought was brilliant: two Jedi together, one with a dark past and she falls for him dispite knowing what he once was) to me was there was no conclusion. They should have added in one extra scene after the defeat of Darth Malek as the only scene afterwards is a PUBLIC ceremony.

 

Your love turns her back from the dark side, making her unable to strike you down... How is that not cool?

[Melly]

Ugh, not this bloody topic again. Why can't people just except that some people see Revan/Exile as male and some see them as female? And let it be?

 

 

I am usually a respecting person of people's opinions but... that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard!

 

PALPATINE: *changing Revan's gender in the archives* "Muhahaha the Republic wont know what hit them! Muhahaha. With Revan now a women, I will rule the galaxy!!! Muhahahaha!!

 

Why!? There is nothing to gain, Revan would be long dead. Just suck it in and face the facts! The only reason you have the other choices is because RPG's are now more open ended in terms of game play and open endedness. Revan WAS a male lightside human Jedi.... actually... maybe he was a Twi'lek?

 

What True_Avery meant, I'm sure, was that Palps deleted all information of Jedi from the galactic archive. Information about Nomi Sunrider, the Qel-Dromas, Revan, Bastila, Malak, Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, and any information about the ways of the Jedi and Jedi lore (this is why Tionne was so useful to Luke). So any information about Revan would be gone possibly including who his/her master was, and what race and gender Revan was.

[Darth Kalverys]

I can't believe this hs aroused this much debate... I mean seriously who cares? Just play with who you want to play with, whatever gender you want to play with... my first response was just because that's what Obsidian and Bioware said. Why does it even matter?

[Jediphile]

Why does it even matter?

 

It matters because the incarnation of Revan or exile we see outside the games in novels and comic books will be the canonic one, and none of us want to see the "wrong" Revan or exile there. For example, both Revan and exile will be important in the KotOR comic book if it runs long enough. Heck, I think we've actually seen Revan already, though his/her gender was obscured.

[True_Avery]

I am usually a respecting person of people's opinions but... that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard!

 

PALPATINE: *changing Revan's gender in the archives* "Muhahaha the Republic wont know what hit them! Muhahaha. With Revan now a women, I will rule the galaxy!!! Muhahahaha!!

 

Why!? There is nothing to gain, Revan would be long dead. Just suck it in and face the facts! The only reason you have the other choices is because RPG's are now more open ended in terms of game play and open endedness. Revan WAS a male lightside human Jedi.... actually... maybe he was a Twi'lek?

 

All the game makers meant was "This is what it's supposed to be, but the way you play your game is up to you."

I'm glad to know my comments can be debated in a respectable and mature way. I'm also glad that you forced your opinion down my throat, makes you that much more likable.

 

What True_Avery meant, I'm sure, was that Palps deleted all information of Jedi from the galactic archive. Information about Nomi Sunrider, the Qel-Dromas, Revan, Bastila, Malak, Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, and any information about the ways of the Jedi and Jedi lore (this is why Tionne was so useful to Luke). So any information about Revan would be gone possibly including who his/her master was, and what race and gender Revan was.

Thank you for clearing that up.

 

This topic can't go anywhere but further into the garbage. Lets just drop it and let opinions be opinions. The fact of the matter is not a single one of us will agree with the other because each and every single one of us played our characters different and believe that is how it should have been played.

[stoffe]

Mod note: Things are starting to get a bit heated here. Please keep this respectful, everyone. You may state your opinion and why you feel like that, but refrain from trying to shove it down the throat of others, use "but Important Person X says this is how you should play!" arguments or belittle those who feel differently.

 

There is no "correct" way to play the game or build the protagonists, no one way it's "meant to be played", otherwise they would not have bothered to give the players the choice to pick gender or light/dark alignment.

[Rockstar]

I'm glad to know my comments can be debated in a respectable and mature way. I'm also glad that you forced your opinion down my throat, makes you that much more likable.

 

I would like to actually apologise for being so forceful with my opinion. That was unfair to bash you like that and you took it well. The moderator's comment did not prompt me to say this in any way, it was actually your response. Sorry i went a bit too far there. *shakes hand*

 

While i still stand by the fact that while game play is up to the player's disgression and that Revan is a male human, I should not have gone about it a different way.

 

Good on ya for taking it like an adult

[True_Avery]

I would like to actually apologise for being so forceful with my opinion. That was unfair to bash you like that and you took it well. The moderator's comment did not prompt me to say this in any way, it was actually your response. Sorry i went a bit too far there. *shakes hand*

 

While i still stand by the fact that while game play is up to the player's disgression and that Revan is a male human, I should not have gone about it a different way.

 

Good on ya for taking it like an adult

Thanks for Apologizing, no hard feelings ^.^

[Lord Spitfire]

That makes no sense to me. I've always felt the exile should be male for two reasons.

 

The first is due to love interests. The male exile caused or was at least a factor in Atris' fall to the dark side due to her feelings for him. It makes sense that she loves the male exile, which is a major plot point, which is weaker for the female exile. Instead the female exile has Sion's love, which makes no sense whatsoever and comes straight out of the blue. Then there is the relationship to handmaiden and disciple, but we'll get to that.

 

The other reason is due to the exile's nature. In short, the exile is pretty pathetic. I mean, this person has been in utter denial about what really happened at Malachor V and is responsible for the destruction Nihilus has wrought as a result, according to the jedi masters. This is a person with some pretty severe psychological problems. And so it turns out, of course, that canon dictates it must be a woman... I don't like the implications that lie in that statement. And so I think it would be more fitting for it to be a man.

 

 

 

I don't know if I agree Mical works better for females. I mean, take a look at some of the things he says:

 

"I met you on Dantooine, long ago, briefly. You taught us the ways of the Force, how to hear it sing within others, within the life around Dantooine. You taught us the ways of combat, how to hear music within the movements of a lightsaber blade. You taught us how to move within the Force, and see it flow within others. How to see it in the behaviors of others, and use that sight to achieve truth. It is difficult to explain the difference between you and Master Vrook, but I think it is because he was knowledgeable, but not a leader, not a mentor. You were different - we could all feel it. {A little quiet, baring his soul}And I knew that if I were to have a Master, I would want it to be you. And then you went to war. Many Jedi went to war, and the Jedi Masters proclaimed that you were Jedi no longer. Atris, the mistress of the archives, was first among them. I knew at that moment, that if you would no longer be a Jedi, then you must be correct. I realized I did not want to be a Jedi - instead, I wished to follow your path. And in any event, there was no one to train me, even if I wished it. They all went to war, as I grew past the age of acceptance.It is possible to forget the Force, you know - if you not have felt it strongly enough, then there is little to miss. But I never felt the Force as strongly as I did when I was with you.And so I decided to serve the Republic, study the Jedi teachings, gather them, perhaps. It was important to me to understand the Jedi now that they were gone.I felt some part of you should be preserved, so that your lessons would not be lost."

 

Now, given that Mical will follow only a female exile and not a male, all this rings wrong, because it's obvious that he is attracted to the female exile. That puts his "admiration" for the exile as a leader and teacher in a highly suspicious light whether he is aware of it or not. Besides, if this is how he feels for the female exile alone, then the she should be the last person in the universe to teach him the ways of the force, since his emotions are clearly in his way - the masters would and should never have allowed it. He is a love-sick little puppy who is out of his depth, and according jedi rules that could lead nowhere positive. For someone who holds so true to the jedi code as Mical does, it is frankly sickening that he doesn't see this himself. A male exile could teach him, because there are no emotions. But a female exile? No way!

 

 

 

I don't see how Brianna will follow a female exile unless the cut scene is restored where Atris orders her to do so. She has a very low opinion of the exile, but is attracted to the male exile. Though she is a love interest in the game, I don't think she is a healty one because she sees her father in the male exile, which is not a good thing. Regardless, her "Cinderella"-position beneath her sisters, her growth as a character, and her eventual triumphant return where she bests her sisters and confronts Atris for the male exile's affections is a powerful plot. So even though I don't think there can ever be any lasting relationship between her and the male exile, because she will always be looking for her lost father there, I do think it adds up to a powerful arc that helps the overall story and game. That it is axed by canon is frankly a crime

 

 

 

The exile-Sion love relationship is sickening. It has no basis in anything and comes straight out of the blue. If there had at least been an explanation, like if Sion turns out to be someone the exile had a close relationship with in the past (like the male exile and Atris), then it would at least have made some semblance of sense. As it is now, it looks tacked on - thrown in at the last second to balance the male exile/Atris-bit. But it's just very, very, very, exceedingly pathetic plot as it is now. Even for the canonic female exile it should be axed for that reason alone!

 

You know, I always thought that Revan and Exile should be male, and after reading your reasons, I now know why.

 

The only part of that which I disagree with is that Brianna had a low view of the Exile. This is untrue, as Brianna herself says: "I do not believe that you are the monster that Atris has made you out to be," the first time I talked to her on the Ebon Hawk. She still believed in the Exile. Just with Male Exile, THEN she started getting all goggly-eyed.

 

So, I think that regardless of male and female, both Handmaiden and Disciple are in the party(take out that GO-TO psycho). Oh, how i wish so badly I had it on PC. I heard there was a mod . . . sniff, sniff . . .

 

I agree on all of the points you made except that. The reason Obsidian created Canon female was because they were scared that people were going to start calling them sexist for making both Revan and Exile male. If they wanted to have female work, change da plot mon'!

 

But I would classify Exile as "pathetic." I might be slightly hypocritical in this, but have you ever felt the lives of thousands so well connected to you ripped off, and having the currents of the galaxy sucked from you? Besides, the Exile DID talk about it, but he just didn't want to.

 

There was actually a slight reference to the Mass Shadow Generator.

 

After Visas said how Nihilus destroyed her homeworld, you can say: "I have seen similar acts of mass destruction {pause} at Malachor."

[Saber-Scorpion]

i all ways plays as lightside casue i think it's so much easier to be a lightside and i always choose the lightside because in most movies and games it always end with the lightside wins now i'm not meaning that the darkside always loose but i rather help people then destroy them and i always plays as a male i know it's not canon for tsl but i can't play as a female not anything bad about them but i just like being male

[Diego Varen]

So, I think that regardless of male and female, both Handmaiden and Disciple are in the party(take out that GO-TO psycho). Oh, how i wish so badly I had it on PC. I heard there was a mod . . . sniff, sniff . . .

 

I always wanted that. GO-TO's character would have been better if he had stayed on Nar Shaddaa, perhaps still trying to send bounty hunters after you. Besides HK and T3, I wouldn't want more than two droids. Both Handmaiden and Disciple are important to the game, but Handmaiden has a slight tad more importance, due to Atris.

[Emperor Devon]

GO-TO's character would have been better if he had stayed on Nar Shaddaa, perhaps still trying to send bounty hunters after you.

 

Perish the thought! If he stayed on Nar Shaddaa it would've been impossible to find out his past or talk to him about it.

 

Goto's character IMO was very interesting. An extraordinarily intelligent droid who was created to protect the Republic, and through his intelligence realized he could only protect it working against everything it stood for - very ironic. Another bonus is how he's not even Force-sensitive. It was a nice change to have an interesting character (and a droid at that) who could a critical role in protecting the galaxy, and lying and manipulating the PC. He's kind of like Kreia in a lot of respects.

 

It would've been impossible to find all that out if he'd stayed on Nar Shaddaa. IMO listening to him talk about his past is much more interesting than it would've been for him to order more bounty hunters to kill you (which would've had no connection to the main plot at all).

[Vaelastraz]

Goto's character IMO was very interesting. An extraordinarily intelligent droid who was created to protect the Republic, and through his intelligence realized he could only protect it working against everything it stood for - very ironic. A

 

QFE!

 

The basic concept of GOTO is very creative. It's too bad his final impact on the game (at Malachor..) got cut out. More interaction with Goto and more quests concerning him and his operations would have been nice.

But still, sometimes Obsidian just did a brilliant job, think about all that evidence you found that suggests Goto controls everything on Nar Shadda.

[Jediphile]

Goto's character IMO was very interesting. An extraordinarily intelligent droid who was created to protect the Republic, and through his intelligence realized he could only protect it working against everything it stood for - very ironic. Another bonus is how he's not even Force-sensitive. It was a nice change to have an interesting character (and a droid at that) who could a critical role in protecting the galaxy, and lying and manipulating the PC. He's kind of like Kreia in a lot of respects.

 

Like Kreia, lots of people really hate GOTO. I guess it's because they are both highly condescending and arrogant individuals, at least in how they interact with other people. Some hate Kreia because she is so manipulative and how she uses the exile, and some hate GOTO because he is arrogant in the extreme and serves no useful purpose in combat, whereas Kreia does.

 

To me, however, they are both interesting characters. GOTO actually have some very interesting things to reveal, and though he is clearly a terrible person (droid) with utter disregard for life, he is still a highly interesting character. His greatest problem is that he is also completely useless as an active character in the group except in a few specific places in the game. But he reminds me of HAL in 2001, which is probably where the inspiration came from. That big red eye is a dead giveaway. And like HAL, he has gone on a murderous spree because of conflicting directives in his programming. In and off itself that is interesting, and I think the voice-acting for GOTO is brilliant - you have to hear him say only a few sentences to really not like him very much. For someone you're supposed to dislike, the execution is perfect in both dialogue, delivery, tone and the cold aggression or hatred that is expressed. Excellent voice-acting by Daran Norris.

[mjpb3]

The fact of the matter is not a single one of us will agree with the other because each and every single one of us played our characters different and believe that is how it should have been played.

I absolutely and wholeheartedly agree with this. I've debated, ranted, discussed and argued this topic until I am sickened by the whole thing, really. The honest truth is that no matter what reason someone else gives me for their own personal choice, and no reason that any Lucas employee can give me, or whatever else is written, said, or otherwise, Revan and Exile will always be LSF for me, and there's nothing whatsoever at all that will change my mind. That's not to say that anyone else is wrong in their personal gender choice for Revan or Exile, just that my choice is, was, and always will be LSF for both. There's no argument at all for me. That's just the way I perceive both Revan and Exile, and as long as I am able to character create the both of them, that is how they will always be for me.

 

No matter what the so called "canon" of Revan or Exile is, as long as the game(s) have a character creation then it is entirely your choice, and mine, as to whether Revan or Exile are male/female/LS/DS/gizka or otherwise, so this whole argument is more for arguments sake than anything really because no one person here is ever going to agree with me on how precisely I perceive either Revan or Exile. And truthfully, I don't want anyone to agree with me! They're my characters, so my perception of them is mine alone. But, I do reserve the right to perceive Revan and exile anyway I see fit. No one should ever tell me (or anyone) why my choice is wrong. My choice is no more wrong than anyone else's because it is MY choice, just as your choice is YOURS.

[Ctrl Alt Del]

^That's a lot of phrases to say the same thing: There's no "right" gender for them.

[Rockstar]

I prefer male DS Revan and male LS Exile... but the fact is the cannon is LSM Revan and LSF Exile... Just accept it as I have.

 

Still play the others like you would otherwise but if TSL were a playstation 1 game then you would only have the choice to go male Revan and female Exile, and at a pinch, be able to choose the dark path as an option.

 

It is the new generation RPG customisability that allows the player this choices in thier character, companions and game outcome. The fact remains that when Star Wars is such a huge universe of stories, there needs to be an achievable story, hense a LSM Revan and a LSF exile.

 

KOTOR3, if linking with the other 2 stories will most definately need to follow the cannon, because now the outcome possibilities have doubled again:

 

- Darth Revan in outter rim and Dark Exile following him

- Darth Revan in outter rim and Light Exile hunting him

- Jedi Revan in outer rim and Dark Exile hunting him

- Jedi Revan in outer rim with light exile following him

 

Now multiply each of these by 4 to give the gender possibilities:

 

MR, ME

MR, FE

FR, ME

FR, FE

 

That's 16 alternatives.

 

Now lets say KOTOR 3 is released and someone buys it before even looking at the first two... how will they know? I had to pace myself through the story of TSL without playing KOTOR1 and if Revan and the Exile are in the third game, the game developers either have the hell of a task on thier hands or will have to go with the cannons.

[Vaelastraz]

On my first playthrough I always play male characters, because I want to identify myself with the character I play. My decisions are the decisions I would personally make if I were the character in the game.

 

And therefore both are LSM for me. I accept cannon though as the Exile is a somewhat poor character to me.

[Talwin]

The female Revan dialog and plot was far more interesting and I found it consuiderably more fun as compared to playing as male. I was little disappointed to find out that they canonized Revan as a male.

 

In TSL, I think it's really all about Handmaiden vs. Disciple characters. I always found Disciple fake - especially after you see his spy report. Handmaiden, on the other hand, has a very interesting story and she adds neat little perks to the character. I liked playing male Exile much more than female, and once again was disappointed that they canonized it as female.

[Titanius Anglesmith]

I don't really care what canon says. I always think of both Revan and the Exile as male. Everything just makes more sense that way, from their personality traits to their romantic affiliations. Especially with the Exile; I just cringe every time I hear someone mention the thing Sion has for a female Exile.

[Marauder's Fury]

I fancy Revan as male and Exile as female, based on their respective stories. However, I like to play with a female Revan and a male Exile. That being said, LucasArts decided Revan to be male and Exile to be female, and this is all that matters. They could announce a female Revan and a male Exile as canon and we would still be busy rubbing each other's ear here. That's the problem with RPGs. Does anyone question Kyle Katarn's gender? He's male, completely and utterly. No confusion, no bickering. Very smart move, if you ask me. Well... to think, I hope nobody starts an argument about Jacen's gender, too. I should go check the Jedi Knight forum to be sure.

[Gargoyle King]

Does anyone question Kyle Katarn's gender? He's male' date=' completely and utterly. No confusion, no bickering. Very smart move, if you ask me. [/quote']

 

The JK series is far better in my opinion than KOTOR anyway - they just don't seem to get boring - even Dark Forces!

 

Well... to think' date=' I hope nobody starts an argument about Jacen's gender, too[/quote']

 

Or Species!

[JediRevan]

With all the pc mods for KOTOR and KOTOR2, I'm really surprised no one has started a debate concerning Revan or Exile's species.

[stoffe]

Does anyone question Kyle Katarn's gender? He's male' date=' completely and utterly. No confusion, no bickering. Very smart move, if you ask me. [/quote']

 

Which is why I liked Jaden Korr/Jedi Academy better. If you are allowed some measure of customization it's easier to connect with the character. Though it's somewhat more forgivable in a shooter game like Jedi Outcast/Academy since the story isn't quite as important there as in an RPG. (Though you could change Kyle in Jedi Outcast via mods.)

 

Unless you have a very compelling reason to lock the player to a single pre-determined protagonist it's usually better to offer a choice, IMO. Being given the choice can be a strong selling point of the game, in particular if the player has come to expect being able to shape their character to some extent.

 

(For example, I refused to buy ST:Elite Force II even though I liked the original because they did just that, limited the player into one role by not giving you the choice to continue playing as Alexandria Munro if you wanted, you were shoehorned into the role of Alexander Munro regardless of how you played ST:EFOR1. What they provided didn't match the view of the character I had formed from the previous game, so I lost interest in continuing to play the series.)