Please badmouth Secret VGA for me

[BaronGrackle]

Hey! Other than the sunset, stump joke, different close-ups, and extra music, I've heard mention of various glitches in the VGA version of Secret?

 

The only one I know of is something about lighting, when sprites are in dark areas versus brighter areas. Are there bugs other than this?

 

Is there a website or set of articles that go over the differences in detail?

Edited August 2, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[Thrik]

It’s worth noting the floppy and CD VGA releases are different. For example, some art was slightly recoloured for the CD version, and as you noted the CD version also saw the removal of the ‘sprites are an appropriate brightness specific to the scene’ tech.

 

Not sure about an exhaustive list. I know we’ve observed many things over many threads here.

[Scummbuddy]

They forgot to reveal "the secret".

[ThunderPeel2001]

1 hour ago, BaronGrackle said:

Hey! Other than the sunset, stump joke, different close-ups, and extra music, I've heard mention of various glitches in the VGA version of Secret?

 

The only one I know of is something about lighting, when sprites are in dark areas versus brighter areas. Are there bugs other than this?

 

Is there a website or set of articles that go over the differences in detail?

 

It's not the VGA version per se, it's the VGA CD version. It introduced the godawful cacophony that is Stan's song (my personal take, obviously), and several known bugs that ScummVM has since fixed. (I did literally explain this to you in this post, two days ago... 🤔)

 

On 7/31/2022 at 8:20 PM, ThunderPeel2001 said:

It was actually added (by a totally different composer -- who also remixed the music tracks so they looped less frequently). It was added... along with many bugs (that ScummVM now fixes).

 

I remember there was a website that listed every change, but generally speaking the VGA floppy (and Amiga) versions are fine. It's only really the CD version that had issues. (And guess which version they based the Special Edition on? 😅🤦‍♂️😥)

 

If you want to read more about the bugs in the CD version, this post has explicit details on some of them:

 

 

Edited August 2, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[Thrik]

I was watching an Escape from Monkey Island video on YouTube recently, and not only were there people saying EMI is their favourite Monkey Island, the conversation somehow turned to Stan’s music and someone said the original game’s Stan theme was their favourite in the entire series.

 

As you can imagine… I heartily agreed.

[BaronGrackle]

30 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

 

It's not the VGA version per se, it's the VGA CD version. It introduced the godawful cacophony that is Stan's song (my personal take, obviously), and several known bugs that ScummVM has since fixed. (I did literally explain this to you in this post, two days ago... 🤔)

 

 

I remember there was a website that listed every change, but generally speaking the VGA floppy (and Amiga) versions are fine. It's only really the CD version that had issues. (And guess which version they based the Special Edition on? 😅🤦‍♂️😥)

 

If you want to read more about the bugs in the CD version, this post has explicit details on some of them:

 

 

 

In the post two days ago you did literally mention that ScummVM fixed certain bugs. One of my reasons for this post was to get more information on those bugs specifically.

Thank you for linking them! Growing up, I did notice the clock tower would "skip" its second line if you left the room. Very interesting.
 

25 minutes ago, Thrik said:

I was watching an Escape from Monkey Island video on YouTube recently, and not only were there people saying EMI is their favourite Monkey Island, the conversation somehow turned to Stan’s music and someone said the original game’s Stan theme was their favourite in the entire series.

 

As you can imagine… I heartily agreed.

 

Have you physically danced to it while haggling? It's good energy.  Unless Return has Stan selling us another ship or something, I'm going to always associate his first theme with "make a major purchase from me" Stan, as opposed to the "do something unto me" version in the other games.

 

The Go Tell Aunt Rhodie version is fine. And it's pretty darn appropriate when Stan is in his death-related ventures for Revenge and Curse.

Edited August 2, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[Romão]

42 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

 

It introduced the godawful cacophony that is Stan's song (my personal take, obviously)

 

I must say, although I somewhat get your dislike for that musical cue, I do like its rendition in the "Cursed" edition of the Secret of Monkey Island soundtrack:

 

 

[Jake]

Yes, Stan’s theme “Cursed” style really does sound like it belongs. Great work by @AndywinXp !

[Thrik]

I’m not totally sold on Stan’s theme matching up to the rest of the soundtrack in terms of melodic power, but yeah it does fit in better, and damn that Cursed soundtrack is just generally fantastic once it has the harder hitting tracks to work with.

[Jake]

Yeah, it wrings about as much is possible out of that Stan theme. And I love its arrangement of the Circus, and the way A Pirate I Was Meant To Be sneaks in as the intro to the SCUMM Bar. The whole point of that soundtrack is to retcon the Curse feeling back into Monkey 1 and it does a lovely job of it.

[KestrelPi]

The main melody isn't particularly interesting, I'll grant, but the B section I do think has an interesting melody, and goes harmonically off-piste in a way that tickles my ears (and that Cursed version, nice as it is, I don't quite think reproduces - seems to get a bit confused after the 3rd chord of the B section).

[BaronGrackle]

1 hour ago, Romão said:

 

I must say, although I somewhat get your dislike for that musical cue, I do like its rendition in the "Cursed" edition of the Secret of Monkey Island soundtrack:

 

 

This version is nice and easy to listen to on a playlist. But within the game itself (in my opinion), it would be too low-key, too subtle, too quiet and smooth. Is that a marimba? I'm missing out on the trumpets! Stan's shipyard music is big and brassy and in your face. It's huge and obnoxious and as loud as his jacket. Blaring horns and crashing cymbals! The man drags you into a used car commercial and suffocates you! I enjoy how the Special Edition treated it.

Edited August 2, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[Niemandswasser]

4 hours ago, Thrik said:

It’s worth noting the floppy and CD VGA releases are different. For example, some art was slightly recoloured for the CD version, and as you noted the CD version also saw the removal of the ‘sprites are an appropriate brightness specific to the scene’ tech.

 

Not sure about an exhaustive list. I know we’ve observed many things over many threads here.

Let's not forget maybe the biggest change from floppy to CD: replacing the original text-only inventory with visual icons (and removing the extraneous "Turn on" and "Turn off" verbs).

[BaronGrackle]

Okay, that reminds me: the key prize in the cereal box. You could use it to unlock the cabinet without "opening" the prize.

 

Would this be a case of the graphics for the CD version being in error? Would it make more sense to interpret the key as loose in the cereal box, instead of inside a package?

[AndywinXp]

The more the Cursed soundtrack comes out in these threads (thanks by the way, I appeciate it), the more I feel the urge to "remaster" it and give it a new coat of polish 🙂

Edited August 2, 2022 by AndywinXp

[Huz]

1 hour ago, BaronGrackle said:

Okay, that reminds me: the key prize in the cereal box. You could use it to unlock the cabinet without "opening" the prize.

 

Would this be a case of the graphics for the CD version being in error? Would it make more sense to interpret the key as loose in the cereal box, instead of inside a package?

Hmm - I think without the icon, the state of the prize is open to interpretation. I never thought of it as being inside a package and I don't think you have to "open" it to discover it's a key - just "look at" it will suffice. Of course, maybe the game is treating "look at" as "look inside", but who knows?

[BaronGrackle]

12 minutes ago, Huz said:

Hmm - I think without the icon, the state of the prize is open to interpretation. I never thought of it as being inside a package and I don't think you have to "open" it to discover it's a key - just "look at" it will suffice. Of course, maybe the game is treating "look at" as "look inside", but who knows?

Without the packaging: the old captain hid his key in a cereal box - arguably the one nearest the front, since Guybrush coincidentially grabs the correct one.

 

With the packaging: the prize included in the cereal box by the manufacturers is a key that happens to open the cabinet on the Sea Monkey - arguably the cabinet uses a very basic "lock" that can be easily picked.

 

Equal parts silly to plausible for each, methinks.

[ThunderPeel2001]

6 hours ago, BaronGrackle said:

This version is nice and easy to listen to on a playlist. But within the game itself (in my opinion), it would be too low-key, too subtle, too quiet and smooth. Is that a marimba? I'm missing out on the trumpets! Stan's shipyard music is big and brassy and in your face. It's huge and obnoxious and as loud as his jacket. Blaring horns and crashing cymbals! The man drags you into a used car commercial and suffocates you! I enjoy how the Special Edition treated it.

 

You summed up everyone wrong with the original mess and everything right with this "Cursed" remix 😉 The original silence remains best to my ears...

 

Re: Turn off/on. I remember knowing the game so well that I seem to recall at least one line being cut from the CD version as a result of the change to the MI2 interface... but I can't remember where. Turn off stove? Really can't remember.

 

You lose the amusing descriptions of the melting mugs, too 

Edited August 2, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

Guybrush has comments for Turning On and Off the grog machine.

[madmardi]

15 hours ago, Thrik said:

I was watching an Escape from Monkey Island video on YouTube recently, and not only were there people saying EMI is their favourite Monkey Island...

 

🥰😍🤩

 

6 hours ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

You lose the amusing descriptions of the melting mugs, too 

 

Tell me more!

Edited August 3, 2022 by madmardi

[Huz]

I think the cabinet was also a cereal box prize. The key is just another part of a matching set.

[MurraySchull]

16 hours ago, AndywinXp said:

The more the Cursed soundtrack comes out in these threads (thanks by the way, I appeciate it), the more I feel the urge to "remaster" it and give it a new coat of polish 🙂

 

It's a fantastic recreation of the soundtrack! Have you thought about doing the same with MI2? Appreciate it's a bigger soundtrack, but have you thought about maybe doing the most "iconic" tracks?

Edited August 3, 2022 by fentongames

[Lagomorph01]

Oh, my god! I never knew Stan's theme wasn't in the non CD versions of SMI!!! That's a hell of a change if I ever saw (or heard) one!

I never cared much for Stan's theme in the CD version, but, looking at the scenes without music, I do kinda miss it in the EGA/Floppy VGA version.

(Or is that somewhat of an unpopular opinion?)

[Jake]

I think the scene plays well with music. It is also good silent, but a little creepier. 

[Thrik]

Yeah it’s weird. Melee Island in general had this very creepy quietness to it when I played it as a child, with no ambient sound effects like in the CD version, and slightly less music too.

 

It was jarring to hear the music, although it is appropriate, as it was always an eerily still, lonely dock for me. Especially when you explore minus Stan.