Which Monkey Island has the smallest number of monkeys?

[Lagomorph01]

With numbers like 3 to 5 and even 14/15, it seems like the only TRUE Monkey Island games are Curse and Escape!

[BaronGrackle]

  On 9/1/2022 at 6:24 PM, JacquesSparkyTail said:

a solid 66.6 recurring

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"Most pirates call it Hell."

 

The Secret of Monkey Island is that you need at least one Jojo to access the hellgate.

 

Jojos are the true key to the hellgate. Jojos scattered at key points to tear the fabric itself.

 

 

Jojos to unlock, channel, and animate the living hell-golem of metal and steam.

 

A horde of Jojo slaves operating the hellgate as itcturns living souls to undead skeletons, some Jojos periodically visible in the upper right window (only a tail is in this image).

 

 

Jojos to open the gateway to crossroads, connecting the planes of reality and making possible the shattering of that barrier with fantasy.

 

 

Jojos. Are. The. Key. To. Hell.

 

 

Now. Can we just get confirmation that, apart from Murray, these other skulls are from monkeys named Jojo?

 

Edited September 1, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

  On 9/1/2022 at 2:35 PM, Remi said:

It's the same monkey. Same. Monkey.

 

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OBJECTION!

 

Half the monkeys I know wear cute little blue hats.

 

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You are indeed right. I guess this lowers SOMI's count!

 

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I love this thread.

[Niemandswasser]

  On 9/1/2022 at 6:52 PM, BaronGrackle said:

Now. Can we just get confirmation that, apart from Murray, these other skulls are from monkeys named Jojo?

 

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I'll go one further--have we seen any evidence to this point that Murray was not, prior to his necrofication, a monkey named Jojo? Note that he says, on his introduction in CMI, "You may call me Murray," not "My name is Murray" [emphasis added]. I think it's entirely possible he was attempting to conceal his true place in.....THE CONSPIRACY!!!!

[Marius]

Lovely topic as usual, but please hide ReMI things in a spoiler box k thx bye! 

[Niemandswasser]

  On 9/1/2022 at 6:11 PM, Vainamoinen said:

@Thrik @NoirReservoir I admire your spunk. But you're wrong. 😆

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Pirate spunk?

[LowLevel]

The correct answer to the poll doesn't even appear among the poll options. 🧐

 

The Monkey Island game that has the smallest number of monkey is the demo of "The Secret of Monkey Island" (in "Passport to Adventure"). It has zero monkeys!

 

Unless you find a MI game with a negative number of monkeys, I'll assume I've won. 🤓

[BillyCheers]

  On 9/1/2022 at 5:59 PM, Niemandswasser said:

Even as a preteen I remember thinking the marketing listing "more monkeys than ever!" as some sort of selling point was really bizarre. Like, did they think that to this point I'd been playing these games because of the monkeys?

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Maybe not back then. But looking at this thread this may be one of more important reasons in the future.

Another proof that EMI clearly was ahead of its time. 🤯

 

(This is so great! 🍿😬)

Edited September 1, 2022 by BillyCheers

[JacquesSparkyTail]

10 year old me: Monkeys? Shut up and take my (parents) money!!!

 

20 year old me: A lynchian exploration of human relationships through the perspective of an amateur finding his footing in adult life? Sounds most enjoyable.

 

30 year old me: Monkeys? Shut up and take my money!!!

[ThunderPeel2001]

  On 9/1/2022 at 5:59 PM, Niemandswasser said:

Even as a preteen I remember thinking the marketing listing "more monkeys than ever!" as some sort of selling point was really bizarre. Like, did they think that to this point I'd been playing these games because of the monkeys?

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It was just continuing the joke of putting in silly reasons to buy the game:

 

SOMI:

• "Relentless jabs, and cryptic in-jokes only smart people will understand."

MI2:

• "Void where prohibited."

Curse kind of dropped the ball by actually listing reasons a marketing department would like to see (although they did put silly screenshot captions like, "Learn a valuable trade in lighthouse and VCR repair").

 

 

  On 9/1/2022 at 5:34 PM, Torbjörn Andersson said:

 

Not if you trust the back of the Escape From Monkey Island box. Though for whatever reason, the promise of "more monkeys than the three previous Monkey games combined!" was toned down for the PlayStation 2 version.

 

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I would expect they didn't want to put people off who hadn't played the other games, and so tried to remove any reference to them (eg, "NEW" jokes, "NEW" puns, etc.)

[Aro-tron]

  On 9/1/2022 at 3:10 PM, BaronGrackle said:

Smirk monkey + Banana monkey (Jojo Sr.) + Three-headed monkey + Bride monkey with thicker tail than Jojo Sr. = 6 monkey heads

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Objection! This is madness! The debate is about the least number of monkeys, NOT monkey heads.

 

As per the terms of engagement in this debate set by @Vainamoinen, monkey heads should be used to confirm the presence of a monkey, but note that a monkey can be confirmed by one or more live heads:

 

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If it has one or more live heads and the live head is shown in the game, it counts.

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Since this clearly establishes that a single monkey can have multiple heads, and therefore, the Three Headed Monkey counts as a single monkey.

 

Since it clarifies that the head must be live to count, the Giant Monkey Head may not be counted. Otherwise, we would also have to include the Mad Monkey:

(which I only now realize is meant to be one of the flying monkeys from The Wizard of Oz)

 

Therefore! There are between three and five monkeys in Secret:

-Smirk's training monkey

-The Monkey Island monkey (Jojo)

-The Three-headed monkey (three heads, one monkey)

?-The fake bride monkey that looks like Smirk's

?-The fake bride monkey that looks like Jojo

 

I don't know if it's possible to determine whether the fake bride monkeys are meant to be  the same monkeys from Guybrush's earlier adventures, or whether they are separate monkey of the same species. It seems reasonable that Smirk's monkey is the same, since it was already on Melee Island, but I'm not convinced about the Jojo lookalike.

 

In any case, if there are only three monkeys in Secret, then it is tied with Revenge for the least number of monkeys ...

[KestrelPi]

I don't think the game script should be used as a primary source on which money is which, because it only tells us about how they decided to program something, not about what the intent behind it was.

 

In the MI2 intro do the two monkeys use the same named sprite? If so, by the logic of using the script, they are the same monkey, somehow in two places at once

 

[BaronGrackle]

  On 9/2/2022 at 12:46 AM, KestrelPi said:

I don't think the game script should be used as a primary source on which money is which, because it only tells us about how they decided to program something, not about what the intent behind it was.

 

In the MI2 intro do the two monkeys use the same named sprite? If so, by the logic of using the script, they are the same monkey, somehow in two places at once

 

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So... is Tales in the lead with 1 monkey?

[Aro-tron]

  On 9/2/2022 at 12:46 AM, KestrelPi said:

I don't think the game script should be used as a primary source on which money is which, because it only tells us about how they decided to program something, not about what the intent behind it was.

 

In the MI2 intro do the two monkeys use the same named sprite? If so, by the logic of using the script, they are the same monkey, somehow in two places at once

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I agree that the naming of the sprite doesn't really demonstrate narrative intent (although it would be fun if it did).

 

It got me thinking though ... the dancing monkeys in the credit sequence of Revenge are very similar to the Jojo sprite from Secret. Is it the same sprite? Is it the same Monkey(s)?

 

What if both of the dancing monkeys in Revenge are actually specific monkeys from Secret: the one who hangs on the idol's nose, and the one who dresses up as Elaine?

 

What if THAT is the secret to Monkey Island?

[ThunderPeel2001]

  On 9/2/2022 at 12:44 AM, Aro-tron said:

Objection! This is madness! The debate is about the least number of monkeys, NOT monkey heads.

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It may be madness, but those are the rules:

 

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counted per capita / monkey head shown in the game

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"counter per monkey head"... three-headed monkey = 3 monkeys. QED.

 

  On 9/2/2022 at 12:46 AM, KestrelPi said:

I don't think the game script should be used as a primary source on which money is which, because it only tells us about how they decided to program something, not about what the intent behind it was.

 

In the MI2 intro do the two monkeys use the same named sprite? If so, by the logic of using the script, they are the same monkey, somehow in two places at once

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I wholly disagree with this logic

Edited September 2, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[Niemandswasser]

I feel like until and unless it's contradicted by ReMI the only sporting thing is to accept at face value--for the purposes of the thread, of course--EMI's assertion that Jojo Sr. never left that totem pole. Elaine's wedding monkey must therefore be a different (more robustly-tailed) simian, and in no way should my apparently-irreversible vote for MI2 be seen as influencing this view.

[Vainamoinen]

  On 9/2/2022 at 1:37 AM, ThunderPeel2001 said:

"counter per monkey head"... three-headed monkey = 3 monkeys. QED.

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I really didn't want to introduce any obscure rules here, it just seems fair to me that three monkey brains are counted as three monkeys. 😬 

[Niemandswasser]

  On 9/2/2022 at 6:59 AM, Vainamoinen said:

 

I really didn't want to introduce any obscure rules here, it just seems fair to me that three monkey brains are counted as three monkeys. 😬 

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This is the only interpretation that makes sense, and again, I implore you all to refrain from making ridiculous claims that my MI2 vote is in any way responsible for my saying so.

[Thrik]

  On 9/2/2022 at 6:59 AM, Vainamoinen said:

 

I really didn't want to introduce any obscure rules here, it just seems fair to me that three monkey brains are counted as three monkeys. 😬 

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[Vainamoinen]

  On 9/2/2022 at 8:09 AM, Thrik said:

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LIVE monkey heads. 😆

[Thrik]

Man, these rules are just getting more and more insane!

[BillyCheers]

  On 9/2/2022 at 8:57 AM, Vainamoinen said:

 

LIVE monkey heads. 😆

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It’s a voodoo shop after all. Who’s telling you that it isn’t? 🤨

[Thrik]

Indeed.

 

Did you know that in the demo they referred to the rubber chicken as a DEAD chicken? Implying that in the final game, the rubber chicken we gleefully glide across Meathook’s river with is, in fact, at least a little bit alive.

[Marius]

I have another angle that that causes even more confusion!

What about the box-art Monkeys? Do they count? Do we have to seperate "Logo Monkeys" and "In scene Monkeys"?

@Vainamoinen please clarify!

 

 

  On 9/2/2022 at 9:20 AM, Thrik said:

Did you know that in the demo they referred to the rubber chicken as a DEAD chicken? Implying that in the final game, the rubber chicken we gleefully glide across Meathook’s river with is, in fact, at least a little bit alive.

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According to that Escape box the chicken looks very much alive! Thank you, Playstation 2 version, for clearing that up.

[BillyCheers]

  On 9/2/2022 at 9:41 AM, Marius said:

What about the box-art Monkeys? Do they count? Do we have to seperate "Logo Monkeys" and "In scene Monkeys"?

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Well, in the opening post he clearly said “monkey head shown in the game”

 

  On 9/2/2022 at 9:41 AM, Marius said:

According to that Escape box the chicken looks very much alive!

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But according to that Escape box Elaine also looks she’s on a lot of acid! So…

Edited September 2, 2022 by BillyCheers