The Official Obama debate thread.

[jonathan7]

I thought it better to have all the debate about Obama's presidency in one place, instead of having a million and one threads debating his abilities. So this thread can manoeuvre anywhere in sphere of subjects related to Obama and especially his presidency. I won't as yet lock other threads, however I'd prefer it that criticisms or praise of Obama were in here for now, as he hasn't even yet started office, so seems silly to have a million and one topics about. - j7

 

On a slight side note, for some of you to think about - Obama is now going to be the President, complaining about how bad a candidate he is isn't going to change that fact

[Yar-El]

On a slight side note, for some of you to think about - Obama is now going to be the President, complaining about how bad a candidate he is isn't going to change that fact

So, we should lay down our verbal arms, and let him kill us all? Would you do the same for the oposition? Obama says something and we jump, right?

 

Don't make jokes about suicide--that's horrible. --Jae

[jonathan7]

So, we should lay down our verbal arms, and let him kill us all? Would you do the same for the oposition? Obama says something and we jump, right?

 

Perhaps you may want to offer a viable option for Obama to take instead of just criticising him (n.b. before I'm accused of any bias - I wouldn't of voted for Obama or McCain - though I think Obama was the lesser of two evils. I'm also not American).

[Yar-El]

Perhaps you may want to offer a viable option for Obama to take instead of just criticising him (n.b. before I'm accused of any bias - I wouldn't of voted for Obama or McCain - though I think Obama was the lesser of two evils. I'm also not American).

I will criticise any politician when I feel as I need to. You may not have noticed, but LucasForum's server is on American soil. Congrats on trying to surpress the freedom of speech while using an American based forum.

[jonathan7]

I will criticise any politician when I feel as I need to. You may not have noticed, but LucasForum's server is on American soil. Congrats on trying to surpress the freedom of speech while using an American based forum.

Have I supressed your right to criticise him anywhere? I offered a non Mod comment, hence it not being in green your free to heed or ignore that however, you may want to review the Forum Rules;

 

1. Everyone is reminded that Lucasforums is a privately owned corporation and is a PG-13 forum. You are our invited guests. The staff have the challenging job of keeping the forums clean and presentable while not suffocating open discussion. If a thread is locked or a post is edited or deleted, this was a step deemed necessary in the staff's judgment. Please don't throw around irrelevant constitutional law or try to plea the case for 'less censorship'. We're not censoring, we're exercising quality control on something in which we invest a great deal of effort and time. You may present your views and opinions, whether they're popular or not, but you must do so in a respectful and courteous manner appropriate to a PG-13 forum.

 

May I suggest not trying to tell any member of the Mod team how the forums works.

[Adavardes]

So, we should lay down our verbal arms, and let him kill us all?

 

I lol'd.

 

'Cause.

 

Y'know.

 

McCain was so against killing people.

[Jae Onasi]

The topic is "Obama", not "Yar-El's posting style". Off-topic posts and baiting comments have been removed. Keep it civil and on-topic, please.

[Litofsky]

To bring up an issue for this thread: What do you all think that Obama will do in way of our foreign appeal? Has our reputation be forever tarnished by Bush, or is the damage reparable?

[mur'phon]

He'll be the Messiah for a short time, afterwards the boulevard of broken dreams in his wake will at least make him mortal, probably just another president, and pherhaps the great satan V2.0. I just hope he spends his Messiah time well.

 

And if you think your reputation is forever tarnished by Bush, ask a sub-saharan African what he/she thinks about him and prepare for a surprise.

[jonathan7]

To bring up an issue for this thread: What do you all think that Obama will do in way of our foreign appeal?

 

Whatever else is said; Obama is seen very well in Europe - so inside Europe he will have improved your foreign appeal.

 

Has our reputation be forever tarnished by Bush, or is the damage reparable?

 

I like America The damage isn't un-repairable, and its sad that Bush's presidency is only going to be remembered for the foreign policy - (i.e. the Iraq war). America has much going for it, and it will be interesting to see how things go.

[ForeverNight]

I'm with Mur'phon on this one.

 

I'm sick and tired of the people who worship the very ground he walks on! It's really disconcerting to be in a class of what you thought were rational people and suddenly find out that they don't like Obama... they practically worship him!

 

My friend has even worse stories, he's a member of the local Young Democrats group, or, rather, the Students for Barack Obama group... and there are a lot of kids in it who feel that he's the Messiah!

 

Now, to declare my bias, I wouldn't have voted for him if I could've (2012!) but nor was I all that crazy about McCain.

 

Since kids usually represent their Parent's biases, it's really kinda scary that so many parents like Obama this much!

[Web Rider]

I'm with Mur'phon on this one.

 

I'm sick and tired of the people who worship the very ground he walks on! It's really disconcerting to be in a class of what you thought were rational people and suddenly find out that they don't like Obama... they practically worship him!

 

I agree, it's REALLY creepy how into Obama some people are. Sure, I like the guy and I think he'll do a good job, I mean, Bush is a pretty low standard to beat, but really, this whole craze with thinking that Obama will fix all the wrongs in the world is just weird.

[Litofsky]

I just hope he spends his Messiah time well.

As do I. It'd be a shame if, once in office, none of the promises that threw him into office were delivered.

 

And if you think your reputation is forever tarnished by Bush' date=' ask a sub-saharan African what he/she thinks about him and prepare for a surprise.[/quote']

Indeed. I guess money does buy you friends.

 

Whatever else is said; Obama is seen very well in Europe - so inside Europe he will have improved your foreign appeal.

Europe's certainly a start.

 

I like America The damage isn't un-repairable, and its sad that Bush's presidency is only going to be remembered for the foreign policy - (i.e. the Iraq war). America has much going for it, and it will be interesting to see how things go.

I dare to say that Bush's foreign policy ended up affecting his home policy, too, as opposed to staying overseas.

 

My friend has even worse stories, he's a member of the local Young Democrats group, or, rather, the Students for Barack Obama group... and there are a lot of kids in it who feel that he's the Messiah!

 

Since kids usually represent their Parent's biases, it's really kinda scary that so many parents like Obama this much!

I disagree: many (kids) are more affected by their peer's/close 'friends'' views. It's not always 'cool' to be with your parents in politics, or so I've observed.

 

I agree, it's REALLY creepy how into Obama some people are. Sure, I like the guy and I think he'll do a good job, I mean, Bush is a pretty low standard to beat, but really, this whole craze with thinking that Obama will fix all the wrongs in the world is just weird.

QFT.

[Jae Onasi]

Creepy? 2 words: Obama girl.

[Rev7]

I'm with Mur'phon on this one.

 

I'm sick and tired of the people who worship the very ground he walks on! It's really disconcerting to be in a class of what you thought were rational people and suddenly find out that they don't like Obama... they practically worship him!

 

My friend has even worse stories, he's a member of the local Young Democrats group, or, rather, the Students for Barack Obama group... and there are a lot of kids in it who feel that he's the Messiah!

 

Now, to declare my bias, I wouldn't have voted for him if I could've (2012!) but nor was I all that crazy about McCain.

 

Since kids usually represent their Parent's biases, it's really kinda scary that so many parents like Obama this much!

I definately agree with this. It is really un-nerving, to me at least, that so many people get this caught up in things.

Creepy? 2 words: Obama girl.

[EnderWiggin]

You may not have noticed, but LucasForum's server is on American soil.

 

QFT.

 

Creepy? 2 words: Obama girl.

 

Well, I think that was more in jest than actual truth. A 15 mins of fame sort of thing.

 

_EW_

[Tommycat]

First off, Bush actually won the international medal for PEACE(no not peace, nor Peace as it actually stands for something, but I can't remember what) because of his comitment to education and foreign aid. Please try not to trivialize the few good things he has done. He doesn't have a lot of them.

 

Obama is a good man, and I hope everyone gives him the benefit of the doubt. I also hope that his supporters are honest enough to call him on the things he does wrong. This international craze over Obama will die down rather quickly. For now most of them are still in the "Anybody but Bush" mode, but as soon as Obama does something for the US that others disagree with, we'll be back to being hated again.

[Arcesious]

The only reasons I supported Obama were:

 

His pro-science plans

His pro-environment plans

His speech about why 'politics should be secular'

And because his economic plan sounded better than what the GOP came up with. (But not much better. It was still full of problems.)

 

Other than that, I disagreed with most all the rest of Obama's plans, that and his ties to corrupt people and crazy pastors...

[Adavardes]

I'm with Mur'phon on this one.

 

I'm sick and tired of the people who worship the very ground he walks on! It's really disconcerting to be in a class of what you thought were rational people and suddenly find out that they don't like Obama... they practically worship him!

 

Reminds me of that same religious-like fervor Republicans held for Bush, in spite of the fact that the man couldn't bumble through a sentence without saying a word that didn't, in fact, exist. I'm sorry, there's labelling someone an idiot, and then there's just being unintelligable, which is a major, MAJOR factor in leadership skill, and a precursor for evidence in their cognitive abilities, as well as their intelligence. The man wasn't fit to be anyone's commander in cheif, just like Palin isn't fit to be second in command, for the exact same reason. I don't understand why it seems that, to Republicans, you have to fit a certain mold. White, older, and stupider than you are, and if they aren't stupider, then they're elitist.

 

I don't follow Obama blindly, worshipping him. I don't worship anyone or anything, that's a personal life choice, and one of the things I love about Obama's policies on separation of church and state, something that a lot, not all, but a lot, of Conservative Republicans are against simply because they don't know how to keep religion, which is basically an irrational faith, out of their reason and logic. I have my doubts about whether or not Obama can make the changes he wants to make. His choices thus far are bold, and ballsy, and constructed, in my mind, to both gather as much bipartisan support as he possibly can, so as to have little to no political resistance in the drastic choices he will be making later on, and forming enough socialist and democratic change in the country to earn a re-election.

 

If there's ever been a politician intelligent and tactful enough to pull it off, it's him, but for me, being a left-wing libertarian, that means my policies, the things I agree with, will probably be squandered until Obama changes gears out of his center-left position, back into far left. He'll only do that, though, after he's got the Republican support he'll need to avoid bickering in the senate and congress, and get things done properly. If he can do that, then I personally believe that he'll make strident efforts in ushering this country back into an age of enlightenment, fairness, and peace. Does that mean it will all happen in his term? No, but he sure as hell can set a precedent for foreign policy that has been harshly neglected in the past 8 years in favour of war, work with his best-of-the-best economic team to bring stability, and hopefully a less capitalistic attitude (though those two kinda go hand in hand), to the economy, and begin to alleviate the war debts America faces.

 

He can start working towards leaving his successor the plans for a greener America, begin larger efforts on alternative energies and environmental conservation, raise the quality of living, bridge wealth gaps, pave the way for further redistribution of wealth, and even begin raising the quality of education. That's why I support him, because I think he'll set us down the right track, commence these policies, not complete them, but get them started. That, and I simply do not think conservative policy is at all constructive, nor is it rationally sound, toward any kind of progress. That's why I support Obama, and that's why I'm a liberal in the first place.

 

As per the comments about Obama's "friends"? I'm just not even gonna bother arguing that anymore. Why? Because it's crap. End of story.

[Jedi_Man]

Personally, i really dislike obama. I would've voted for McCain. but thats because im christian and repblicans generally fit that way of life. i mean, im all pro choice, kinda. if a woman wants to screw her life and teh life of her own unborn baby, let her. then she would just be a <snipped>. or just a bad mom, in either case she shouldn't have gotten into bed with someone anyways. or if some gay guy wants to get married to another gay, im alright with that. as long as he doesn't stare at me from across the room. and bush isn't an idiot. what happened over in iraq isn't his fault, wouldn't any one of us , in the heat of the moment, gone to war, all pissed off at the Middle Easterns? we speak with rational hindight, right then and there was were a bloodshed would've broke out.

now ofcourse McCain has his short comings too. he chose the wrong person for VP. if you wanna win the presicency you gotta get someone from a big state. shoulda gone for someone from michigan or something, then he woulda won. but im not going to list all the tiny little discrepencies and wrongs that someones done, at least not yet.

[The Doctor]

Personally, i really dislike obama. I would've voted for McCain. but thats because im christian and repblicans generally fit that way of life.

That's a poor way to go about selecting a political party to vote for. Choosing a candidate simply based on their party's usual ideals is ignorant, at best. McCain is a far cry from the traditional Republican candidate, to be honest, as is Obama from the traditional Democrat.

 

i mean, im all pro choice, kinda. if a woman wants to screw her life and teh life of her own unborn baby, let her. then she would just be a <snipped>. or just a bad mom, in either case she shouldn't have gotten into bed with someone anyways.

Do you know how many women are raped and impregnated every day in the United States? If you had a strangers child violently forced on you, can you say you'd want to carry and give birth to it? Some women just aren't ready to be mothers, and if they have one forced on them, they have every right to abort it. With all due respect, labelling a woman who wants to get rid of a rapist's daughter a bad mother is a poor and incredibly offensive judgement call.

 

or if some gay guy wants to get married to another gay, im alright with that. as long as he doesn't stare at me from across the room.

So, it's ok for a straight man to find a woman attractive, but a gay man isn't allowed to check out another man he finds attractive? So long as he doesn't force himself on the guy, there's no problem with that.

 

and bush isn't an idiot. what happened over in iraq isn't his fault, wouldn't any one of us , in the heat of the moment, gone to war, all pissed off at the Middle Easterns? we speak with rational hindight, right then and there was were a bloodshed would've broke out.

A politician, particularly the leader of one of the most powerful nations in the world, should be calm, rational, and level headed, no matter what's going on. If anyone else had rushed into war just as Bush did, I sure as hell wouldn't have voted for them, either. Saying that it was done in the heat of the moment doesn't justify it, in fact, it only further serves to prove the point that it was a giant mistake.

 

now ofcourse McCain has his short comings too. he chose the wrong person for VP. if you wanna win the presicency you gotta get someone from a big state. shoulda gone for someone from michigan or something, then he woulda won. but im not going to list all the tiny little discrepencies and wrongs that someones done, at least not yet.

If you want to win the Presidency you need to choose a running mate with some semblance of intelligence. Choosing someone "from a big state" doesn't necessarily do jack - a politician from a big state has the potential to be just as stupid as Palin. But I won't argue with you on that one, because at least you acknowledge that Palin was a mistake.

 

EDIT @ Jae below: I'm sorry if I'm coming across as uncivil. It's certainly not my intention. I've edited this post, and will keep a closer eye on myself in the future.

[Jae Onasi]

It's an Obama thread, not an election thread, not an abortion thread, and please don't turn it into a thread about gawking at someone's buns, legs, or assorted other body parts. Doctor, watch how you word your posts so that you don't end up on the wrong side of the 'be civil' rule. You're getting close to the boundary. Jedi_Man--accusing women of being sluts out of hand if they get pregnant, when there may be completely innocent reasons on their part for the impregnation (e.g. rape), is tremendously offensive. Please avoid that characterization in the future. Thank you.

[Web Rider]

Personally, i really dislike obama.

Yet, you don't state why.

 

I would've voted for McCain. but thats because im christian and repblicans generally fit that way of life.

Most Americans are Christians, 78%, give or take. Most Democrats are Christians, yes, they're not the same kind of evangelical christians that the Republican part holds on to, but Obama was a Christian. So then, was Obama the wrong kind of Christian?

 

i mean, im all pro choice, kinda. if a woman wants to screw her life and teh life of her own unborn baby, let her. then she would just be a <snipped>. or just a bad mom, in either case she shouldn't have gotten into bed with someone anyways.

Then clearly, you are pro-choice, and pro-life, which a perfectly reasonable stance, though I think you need to learn a little more about why people would want an abortion first.

 

Also: Given your stance, you could easily have gone for Obama, Obama is pro-life and pro-choice, just like you.

 

or if some gay guy wants to get married to another gay, im alright with that. as long as he doesn't stare at me from across the room.

And Obama, while having to take the Christian line of "marriage is between a man and a woman", at least believes gays should have the right, and it's a state issue.

 

and bush isn't an idiot. what happened over in iraq isn't his fault, wouldn't any one of us , in the heat of the moment, gone to war, all pissed off at the Middle Easterns?

"Middle easterners" did nothing to us. A radical hate group did. Please get your facts straight. It is like being attacked by the KKK, they do not represent Americans, they are a radical hate group.

 

In any case, your views are as much Democrat as they are Republican, so, why not Obama?

[GarfieldJL]

Perhaps you may want to offer a viable option for Obama to take instead of just criticising him (n.b. before I'm accused of any bias - I wouldn't of voted for Obama or McCain - though I think Obama was the lesser of two evils. I'm also not American).

 

Uh huh, we have a guy that pals around with terrorists, worked for a group that specializes in voter fraud, worked with a slum lord (even bought a house with this guy's help), took money from Freddie Mac.

 

And you say he's the lesser of two evils compared to a war hero.

 

Obama is either extremely corrupt, or makes George W. Bush look like a genius, I'm going for extremely corrupt. It's Chicago style politics.

[jonathan7]

Uh huh, we have a guy that pals around with terrorists, worked for a group that specializes in voter fraud, worked with a slum lord (even bought a house with this guy's help), took money from Freddie Mac.

 

And you say he's the lesser of two evils compared to a war hero.

 

Yup that's still my opinion , and I would argue a lot of the above as to what Obama is guilty of is down to opinion, I'll agree its fact when he's tried in a court of law (innocent until proven guilty etc).

 

Obama is either extremely corrupt, or makes George W. Bush look like a genius, I'm going for extremely corrupt. It's Chicago style politics.

 

Unfortunately these days I think most politicians are corrupt, and would suspect Bush is definatly in bed with big business.