Dragon Age 2

[SW01]

They seem to be spending/have spent a considerable amount of time on re-designing aspects of the game - most of the news seems to be centred around 'what's changed?' rather than 'what's new?'

 

For instance, that surprise about the redesign (though the devs assure us not a retcon) of the Qunari, and mention of design changes to elves, dwarves, etc, so really I'm expecting something of a similar gameplay experience with some rather different surroundings. Not that I thought there was anything particularly glaringly bad in Origins, but I'm still not especially fond of the apparent new styling.

 

I got insulted by fanboys

The big reason I'm hesitant about posting there.

[Tysyacha]

I wonder if anyone is going to name their character "Shepard Hawke." *LOL*

[DarthParametric]

[youtube=hd]OruQuvu-HVI

[SW01]

'skip the shoe-leather, skip the interstitial between the key action moments'

 

I think that needs explanation in the months to come...

 

The politicking sounded good, that doesn't so much.

[DarthParametric]

Their new target demographic isn't interested in boring stuff like dialogue or story, it's all about the action! Good thing thing we'll be "fighting like a Spartan" then - whatever the hell that means. Half-naked perhaps?

[Astor]

I'm beginning to dislike this sequel more and more with each announcement and devloper interview.

 

Good thing thing we'll be "fighting like a Spartan" then - whatever the hell that means. Half-naked perhaps?

 

I'm very worried they mean the Halo type of Spartan.

[SW01]

I'm beginning to dislike this sequel more and more with each announcement and devloper interview.

 

Yes...there has been very little that has been particularly encouraging. The only possible light may be the importation of Origins/Awakenings decisions into the game, though I can't really see what relevance most of that will have. Unless we're going to hear some town crier with random little soundbites. Or the Dragon Age equivalent of e-mail.

 

I can't understand the mentality of 'oh the one with lots of exploration and side-quests and interaction was RPG of the year in a lot of places and did very well, but now we need to change as much as possible.'

[Alkonium]

Here's a preview from 1UP. As with the IGN article, they again make reference to orcs and goblins. Seems Bioware's new "more distinctive" art style is working out a treat for the Darkspawn.

 

Well, for all we know, some of the cultures outside of Ferelden may just call Hurlocks Orcs and Genlocks Goblins. Or were they clear that they were separate from the Darkspawn?

[DarthParametric]

I can't understand the mentality

The mentality is the same as that of Sony and MS falling over themselves in an attempt to get a chunk of the casual game market, and the same as making a KOTOR MMO instead of a SP RPG - money. By "streamlining" it they can appeal to the mass market and make bigger sales. ME2 is their model (pretty much literally, in the case of the dialogue system). Now some may say that's not a bad thing and that they enjoyed ME2 more than ME1. For myself, I found ME2 lacking in many areas compared to ME1 (most notably the almost complete gutting of certain RPG elements) and am not overly thrilled with the prospect of DA undergoing a similar transition.

 

Well, for all we know, some of the cultures outside of Ferelden may just call Hurlocks Orcs and Genlocks Goblins. Or were they clear that they were separate from the Darkspawn?

It's the same demo that has been shown everywhere. There are only Darkspawn (an Ogre and some, presumably, Hurlocks) in it, confirmed as such by devs. The whole orc/goblin thing arose because they don't look anything like the Darkspawn of Origins.

[Rake]

Like the devs said, the first info they are going to release is going to center around what separates DA2 from DAO. Why would they come out saying: The loot is the same just better, combat is the same just more stuff, etc... I like the qunari model; I hated Sten in DAO because he looked so generic, just a tall fat human. The races weren't differentiated enough; elves were just malnourished and short humans.

 

The only thing that worries me at this point is the loot system. While they haven't mentioned anything yet, with all this talk of unique character models and animations, it seems as though they may go the mass effect route. All characters unique, but have limited armor sets. Hawke's "starting" armor looks too good to be replaced very early on.

[DarthParametric]

Why have loot when you can just "streamline" it out of the base game and then sell weapon and armour DLC?

[stoffe]

I can't understand the mentality of 'oh the one with lots of exploration and side-quests and interaction was RPG of the year in a lot of places and did very well, but now we need to change as much as possible.'

 

All other concerns aside, I do find it slightly humorous that Electronic Arts generally is vilified as a company that just churns out "more of the same" every year to milk their franchises for all they are worth. And now that Bioware (who are EA) decides to change things in ÐA2 and not just release more of the same people are up in arms about that instead. You really can't win as a game developer it seems.

 

By "streamlining" it they can appeal to the mass market and make bigger sales. ME2 is their model (pretty much literally, in the case of the dialogue system). Now some may say that's not a bad thing and that they enjoyed ME2 more than ME1. For myself, I found ME2 lacking in many areas compared to ME1 (most notably the almost complete gutting of certain RPG elements) and am not overly thrilled with the prospect of DA undergoing a similar transition.

 

From a marketing standpoint it certainly makes sense. The CRPG crowd who found Ðragon Age enjoyable are all pretty much hooked ÐA2 customers already. No matter how many post angry forum rants about them never going to buy it due to the announced changes the vast majority of them will cave in and get the game anyway when it's released. So if you want to increase the size of the customer base you need to branch out to appeal to those who aren't already going to buy it anyway.

[Astrotoy7]

..And now that Bioware (who are EA)

 

How much do EA contribute to such decisions like game design, aren't they moreso BioWare's distributors than a guiding hand in game development? In some places, EA also distributes LucasArts titles.

 

Can we blame them for no JA2 or KOTOR3 as well?

 

mtfbwya

[DarthParametric]

EA bought Bioware. I think it's fair to say they have a significant voice.

[Liverandbacon]

The changes don't mean I refuse to ever buy it, but they have changed the game from a definite purchase to a try and maybe buy, probably only when it hits $20. I was more interested in Witcher 2 from the get-go anyway (most of the changes I've heard about for that game just make me more excited for it). I never complain about games just being more of the same if the original was awesome enough, at least, not until the 4th game in a series.

[DarthParametric]

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/4376174/1

 

The news of no toolset is unsurprising, but if the lack of isometric view in the PC version is true I'll be seriously pissed. Especially given that devs have repeatedly assured us in recent weeks that it was being kept for the PC version. Sounds to me more and more like it has just become a port of a console action-RPG.

[Astor]

The news of no toolset is unsurprising, but if the lack of isometric view in the PC version is true I'll be seriously pissed. Especially given that devs have repeatedly assured us in recent weeks that it was being kept for the PC version. Sounds to me more and more like it has just become a port of a console action-RPG.

 

If that's true, then for me at least, that may well be the deal breaker.

[SW01]

Now just to wait for the announcement 'oh yeah actually it's a console port after all, but here's a shiny new item to make up for it that you could've created in 20 seconds with the toolset that you're not getting.'

[Q]

If there's no isometric view I won't be playing this game.

[jrrtoken]

I find this humorous, in a very sad way. Yes, Dragon Age 2 is being consolized for the masses. Ho-hum; pass the butter.

 

RPGs, and gaming in-general, has become more console-oriented; it's been that way for close to a decade now. Has it really taken just one game for everyone to A) wake up and notice and B) get angry about it? Did anyone realize that each successive BioWare/Bethesda/Obsidian game has been more action-oriented, more "streamlined"?

 

Then, Dragon Age was released, and returned to more orthodox roots. A lot of people liked it, and apparently, many didn't like it. Judging by the sequel, many of the haters were console owners, so now EA/BioWare is creating DA2 with consoles in-mind. It's unsurprising, really, and it's not even upsetting anymore, though it is disappointing.

 

This is the same dilemma that some have been lamenting at for years, but only in a very condensed amount of time. By principle, the same critics of the dumbed-down DA2 should also be wailing over Mass Effect 2, Fallout 3, and every Game of the Year RPG in the last decade, which could also be applied to earlier games like KotOR (though I consider KotOR to still be a rather good RPG, all-in-all).

[DarthParametric]

Seems there is going to be some sort of half-assed isometric view in the PC version - http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/4376174%26lf%3D8#4381246 Sounds to me like even that will probably end up getting scrapped before release.

 

By principle, the same critics of the dumbed-down DA2 should also be wailing over Mass Effect 2, Fallout 3, and every Game of the Year RPG in the last decade

Indeed. Some of us have been doing just that.

[Jeff]

I find this humorous, in a very sad way. Yes, Dragon Age 2 is being consolized for the masses. Ho-hum; pass the butter.

 

RPGs, and gaming in-general, has become more console-oriented; it's been that way for close to a decade now. Has it really taken just one game for everyone to A) wake up and notice and B) get angry about it? Did anyone realize that each successive BioWare/Bethesda/Obsidian game has been more action-oriented, more "streamlined"?

 

Then, Dragon Age was released, and returned to more orthodox roots. A lot of people liked it, and apparently, many didn't like it. Judging by the sequel, many of the haters were console owners, so now EA/BioWare is creating DA2 with consoles in-mind. It's unsurprising, really, and it's not even upsetting anymore, though it is disappointing.

 

This is the same dilemma that some have been lamenting at for years, but only in a very condensed amount of time. By principle, the same critics of the dumbed-down DA2 should also be wailing over Mass Effect 2, Fallout 3, and every Game of the Year RPG in the last decade, which could also be applied to earlier games like KotOR (though I consider KotOR to still be a rather good RPG, all-in-all).

This sounds console-ified to a much larger degree than Mass Effect 2 from Mass Effect was (though I was not a fan of many changes in ME2). Dragon Age was garbage on consoles, it looked like dog **** and the combat system did not look appealing at all. The screenshots they've released of DA2 also look like garbage. I don't think it's unfair for people to be upset when BioWare admitted that the PC version surpassed their expectations in terms of sales and then they go and say **** you to all those buyers.

[DarthParametric]

The debut trailer is out: http://www.joystiq.com/2010/08/17/dragon-age-2-destiny-debut-trailer-tears-us-apart/

 

Another pre-rendered CG-fest that tells you squat about the game. Sigh.

 

And another preview by IGN. This one has a sprinkling of new info.

[igyman]

Well the trailer tells me that Hawke doesn't look like a copy of Leonidas from 300, like I suspected before, but rather like a Dragon Age version of the Prince of Persia. Whether this is an improvement over my first impression, I'm not sure yet.

 

The IGN article was far more useful in terms of info than the trailer.

[DeadYorick]

I don't think it's unfair for people to be upset when BioWare admitted that the PC version surpassed their expectations in terms of sales and then they go and say **** you to all those buyers.

 

Err didn't the 360 version of Dragon Age sell the most? That's what I heard.

 

Anyway, with Dragon Age 2 the Developers are going with the flow toward sales. Games are being primarily developed on the console now and later ported to the PC. RPGs are now no exception and focus more on graphics and "addictive gameplay" then depth or characters.

 

EDIT: Has anyone seen the new trailer?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqxPB-BCLRM

 

It reminds me of the original's Sacred Ashes trailer. Except I still find the disembodied "Kreia"-like voice talking about destiny a real mood killer. Hawke is already reminding me of a mixture of Alistair and Morrigan, and I wouldn't be surprised if the morality system reflected this. If you were good you would be like Alistair giving roses, and if you were bad you would mention you hate weakness.