POLL: Which version of SOMI do you prefer?

[ThunderPeel2001]

Gonna try out this poll feature!

 

If anyone cares: The poll is anonymous. 

Edited August 15, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[Remi]

There are correct answers, by the way: Amiga, Amiga, and unnecessary.

[KestrelPi]

I picked that I love Stan's theme but it really could have done with another option: I like it fine. I think it's a decent tune, fits the character, has some interesting little bits to it, was a good attempt at making MI music from somoene who wasn't involved with the original soundtrack. Not the best thing ever, could live without it, but I enjoy its presence perfectly well.

 

Same with the VGA CD version in general: I like it fine. Probably the best way to listen to the music without having a MT-32 hardware to hand, and I'm fine with the extra bits they added. But I don't think it's essential, or necessary 'better' than vanilla MT-32 version.  (The amiga version I like and I'm nostalgic for, but hearing it with fresh ears it's obvious that while they weren't quite compromising as much as they were with MI2's soundtrack, they still had to cut some corners to make it work.)

[Wally B.]

It's weird, because I've grown up with the VGA floppy version, so when I played the CD and Stan's theme came up I was very weirded out, but got accustomed to it very quickly and I still really enjoy it, I think it's a cool addition to the soundtrack.

When playing EGA or VGA floppy, it does feel like there should be some music there, at least when you're negotiating with Stan.

 

MT-32 has way better sounds than the CD version to me though, the Special Edition music had the potential to be the definitive soundtrack at least, but it has arrangements that feels too much out of place to me. 

[BillyCheers]

Me, I always played the VGA version before, but the twitch stream by @Jakeand @Marius really made me appreciate the EGA version and I think I really like it more now. 🥰

 

Especially since someone mentioned that it often looks like they just used a gradient of the color for fillings – and I somehow can’t unsee it anymore. It just feels a bit “sloppy” designed at times…

 

And Stan’s music: never liked it for the same reasons as mint others here. 

[dwa]

I probably prefer the VGA version (with the updated inventory and verbs), not for the realistic portraits, but because it's pleasing to look at, in general. The EGA version has its charm, but once you reach daylight all that yellow on Monkey Island becomes quite painful to my eyes (Loom EGA remains the best example if I want beautiful minimalism).

 

I don't care for Stan's theme, but the original audio CD music sounds pretty cheap/bland in some scenes (the Special Edition is better in this regard, especially for the second title). I'm in the Adlib minority here; since the graphics are limited and not realistic, I think that limited and unrealistic music suits the general feeling better. Adlib is the Fastpass to my wild child-like imagination theme park. Roland MT-32 is reverby stuff that's nice for theatrical/serious games such as Indy4, but Loom and Monkey Island are tales, to me, so they need to sound like a nursery rhyme.

Edited August 15, 2022 by dwa

[BaronGrackle]

Let me just point out: I've routinely argued with people who tell me that EGA Secret's closeups are "cartoony". 😛
 

My line of reasoning is usually: Did Indy 3 and Loom look cartoony to you? Cob's portrait in Loom is basically the same as Cobb's portrait in Secret. The closeups in Secret are comparable to closeups in other pixel games at this time period meant to be seen as realistic, such as Laura Bow. If they had wanted to, they could have used giant heads like in Maniac Mansion or Zak!

Of course, my current take is: Disnryland Pirates animatronics realism.

 

. . .

 

With so many people hating Stan's theme, am I the only one who's always bored by the blandness of the Voodoo theme? Those scenes could have benefited from an eerie silence.

Edited August 15, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

4 hours ago, KestrelPi said:

picked that I love Stan's theme but it really could have done with another option: I like it fine. I think it's a decent tune, fits the character, has some interesting little bits to it, was a good attempt at making MI music from somoene who wasn't involved with the original soundtrack. Not the best thing ever, could live without it, but I enjoy its presence perfectly well.

 

You baffle me because you clearly state several times that MT-32 is your preference.

 

1 hour ago, BaronGrackle said:

My line of reasoning is usually: Did Indy 3 and Loom look cartoony to you?

 

Indy 3 definitely looked more photo realistic than the original EGA SOMI.

 

 

 

Even Cobb became more photo realistic in McCaig's capable hands. It's not a judgement, just an observation.

 

 

Edited August 16, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

32 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

 

There's a "I can take it or leave it" option 🤷‍♂️

 

Indy 3 definitely looked more photo realistic than the original EGA SOMI.

 

 

 

Even Cobb became more photo realistic in McCaig's capable hands. It's not a judgement, just an observation.

 

 

Full disclosure: the Indy 3 EGA closeup shocked me at how well-done it is.

 

But why did you pick Mancomb? Why not Estevan, or Carla, or Smirk, or Guybrush. Nothing about them screams "cartoon" to me. And in that context, even Mancomb could be some guy with a fat face and missing teeth.

And Cob? Regardless of how well drawn he is in VGA, he's still basically identical in EGA Loom and EGA Secret. Do we think EGA Loom is depicting cartoonish characters and shying away from realism?

 

EDIT: I just realized VGA Secret Cobb is the only version without a unibrow.

Edited August 15, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

Hmm. Cobb looks more like a cartoon in every version compared to SOMI VGA...

[KestrelPi]

I do think the EGA portraits skew more cartoony, but not to a degree that I find particularly jarring when moving from one to the other (as opposed to, say, the SE portraits). It still feels to me like the VGA portraits are in the spirit of the originals, even if they stray from some of the details. the first time I saw the EGA portraits I assumed that perhaps the VGA ones were paintovers, even, until I took a closer look and started to see the difference. If you compare Cobb's mouth and general head shape, for example - very similar in all versions.

[OzzieMonkey]

There should probably be a poll option for the best version of them all: Ultimate Talkie Edition  

[BaronGrackle]

9 hours ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

Hmm. Cobb looks more like a cartoon in every version compared to SOMI VGA...

Do you think Loom is sort of like a cartoon, with its artstyle?

 

EDIT: Granted, the weavers' eyeballs in darkness are a classic cartoon trope. But I also saw it with Star Wars jawas...

And Indy 3, despite having that excellent closeup image, shows little stars/swastikas over people's heads when they get knocked out.

Edited August 16, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[Jake]

This is a good poll. 

[ThunderPeel2001]

7 hours ago, BaronGrackle said:

Do you think Loom is sort of like a cartoon, with its artstyle?

 

EDIT: Granted, the weavers' eyeballs in darkness are a classic cartoon trope. But I also saw it with Star Wars jawas...

And Indy 3, despite having that excellent closeup image, shows little stars/swastikas over people's heads when they get knocked out.

 

I don't know if you're getting triggered by the word "cartoony"? I'm not saying it looks like Bugs Bunny, just more cartoony than the VGA versions. There's an obvious difference in styles, even with Cobb, so it's just finding a word to describe that difference...

[Marius]

The music? I couldn't possibly choose, of course, because my dear Atari ST version wasn't mentioned!

(I don't mind actually. This is a cool poll. )

[Lagomorph01]

I've gone with the VGA CD version, because honestly it's the only version I ever played. (And the only version I own!)

Because of the different opinions on this forum, I'm tempted to try the EGA version for my next playthrough, but until then VGA CD all the way!

 

(It warms my heart that no-one has chosen the Special Edition for their favourite version yet.)

[madmardi]

52 minutes ago, Lagomorph01 said:

(It warms my heart that no-one has chosen the Special Edition for their favourite version yet.)

 

Hey, I was tempted because I really like it... but as much as I like it, the version I'll always prefer is the VGA floppy. That's the one I've grown up on and played 95% of the time.

[BaronGrackle]

2 hours ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

 

I don't know if you're getting triggered by the word "cartoony"? I'm not saying it looks like Bugs Bunny, just more cartoony than the VGA versions. There's an obvious difference in styles, even with Cobb, so it's just finding a word to describe that difference...

 

You see a difference in styles between EGA Cob from Loom and EGA Cobb from Secret? Other than accessories like hat and beard, I don't see a difference between those two.

 

With things like the difference between VGA Cob in Loom vs. VGA Cobb in Secret? With that, I honestly think its more of a difference between artists than between styles. I think VGA Cob in Loom is supposed to look realistic... but the artist for VGA Secret just did his version so very, very well. Minus a few bits like the unibrow and warts.

 

In these early Scumm games, I feel like there's a blend or spectrum for cartoonish<->realistic. It's similar to how Indy 3 has stars showing when someone is knocked out, or Loom has visible eyes behind the darkness of cloaks, but both of these games have other scenes that appear to be as live actiony as possible.

 

EDIT: As you allude to with Bugs Bunny, animation has a wide range. Even the VGA Secret portraits are drawings and thus technically cartoon.

 

But if you're looking for something that may have "triggered" me, then I don't know. These MI6 art discussions have stretched me so far that I've heard people tell me the Special Edition closeups are an improvement over the VGA closeups, because the Special Edition versions are cartoonish like the original EGA. Maybe that's still left a taste in my mouth.

 

Special Edition Estevan is a crime.

Edited August 16, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

Man, I literally said "more cartoony than the VGA versions". I'm only talking about comparing SOMI VGA. The other versions of Cobb are the same level of cartoonishness. And yes, I think Loom looks quite cartoony. Again, not like Bugs Bunny, but more like a graphic novel. Same with SOMI EGA. It just doesn't look photo realistic, nor is it attempting to, where the VGA portraits in SOMI clearly lean towards that.

 

Edited August 16, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

10 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

Man, I literally said "more cartoony than the VGA versions". I'm only talking about comparing VGA. The other versions of Cobb are the same level of cartoonishness. And yes, I think Loom looks quite cartoony. Again, not like Bugs Bunny, but more like a graphic novel. It doesn't look photo realistic, where the VGA portraits in SOMI clearly lean towards.

 

 

Funny enough? I would disagree with "more cartoony than the VGA versions" (emphasis on the plural), because VGA Cob from Loom arguably looks more cartoony per this understanding than EGA Cob and EGA Cobb, because VGA Cob from Loom has the greater color pallette but doesn't do more to define his facial features.

 

It just screams spectrum to me, not a clear division.

 

As you cited, the portrait in Indy 3 is an amazing work of realistic art. Yet also, Indy 3 is the game where you give a trophy filled with ale to a muscled man, see literal bubbles above his head, and then knock him out to see little trophies spinning around - akin to a Bugs Bunny cartoon.

 

But if you tried that kind of "seeing stars" animation in Loom or even Secret? It would've risked breaking immersion.

 

(I may be wrong. I don't remember anyone in Secret "seeing stars", though that kind of Chuck Jones stuff happens in Revenge.)

Edited August 16, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[ThunderPeel2001]

I'll just direct you to what I wrote above, and you can keep arguing with yourself:

 

 

Edited August 16, 2022 by ThunderPeel2001

[BaronGrackle]

23 minutes ago, ThunderPeel2001 said:

I'll just direct you to what I wrote above, and you can keep arguing with yourself:

 

 

We are at an impasse , but it's because I see the EGA versions as equally realistic as SOMI VGA. Just with fewer colors to work with.

 

I don't think you could use EGA's limited color options to make Cob(b) look more realistuc than they did.

Edited August 16, 2022 by BaronGrackle

[Thrik]

It’s not as conspicuous as MI2 but SMI definitely has the cartoon-like moments. The most obvious is the fight on the mansion, which features comic book-style graphical exclamations. There’s also the fact Guybrush gets fired out of cannons straight into solid wood and it doesn’t bloody kill him. Not to mention that he falls off a cliff that collapses Wile E. Coyote-style and then bounces back up off a rubber tree. 😄

[ThunderPeel2001]

11 minutes ago, BaronGrackle said:

I see the EGA versions as equally realistic as SOMI VGA

 

If you can't agree that EGA SOMI looks less photorealistic than VGA SOMI then I think you're at an impasse with reality 🤷‍♂️

 

It doesn't matter the REASON why one looks more cartoony than the other, the bottom line is that one looks more cartoony than the other... 

 

 

(and it is still possible to look more realistic in 16 colours)